Why the Faithful Approve of Torture

by: Susan Brooks Thistlethwaite  |  The Washington Post

Why the Faithful Approve of Torture
Prisoners at Guantanamo Bay. A recent poll shows the more often you go to church, the more you approve of torture. (Photo: Catholic News Agency)

    The more often you go to church, the more you approve of torture. This is a troubling finding of a new survey by the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life. Shouldn't it be the opposite? After all, who would Jesus torture? Since Jesus wouldn't even let Peter use a sword and defend him from arrest, it would seem that those who follow Jesus would strenuously oppose the violence of torture. But, not so in America today.

    Instead, more than half of people who attend worship at least once a week, or 54%, said that using torture on suspected terrorists was "often" or "sometimes" justified. White evangelical Protestants were the church-going group most likely to approve of torture. By contrast, those who are unaffiliated with a religious organization and didn't attend worship were most opposed to torture - only 42% of those people approved of using torture.

    One possible way to interpret this extraordinary Pew data is cultural. White evangelical Protestants tend to be culturally conservative and they make up a large percentage of the so-called Republican "base". Does the approval of torture by this group demonstrate their continuing support for the previous administration? That may be.

    But I think it is possible, even likely, that this finding has a theological root. The UN Convention Against Torture defines torture as "any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person..." White Evangelical theology bases its view of Christian salvation on the severe pain and suffering undergone by Jesus in his flogging and crucifixion by the Romans. This is called the "penal theory of the atonement" - that is, the way Jesus paid for our sins is by this extreme torture inflicted on him.

    For Christian conservatives, severe pain and suffering are central to their theology. This is very clear in the 2002 Mel Gibson movie, The Passion of the Christ. Evangelical Christians flocked to this movie, promoted it and still show it in their churches, despite the fact that it is R-rated for the extraordinary amount of violence in the film. It is, in fact, the highest grossing R-rated movie in the history of film. The flogging of Jesus by the Romans goes on for fully 40 minutes. It is truly the most violent film I have ever seen.

    The message of the movie, and a message of a lot of conservative Christian theology, is that severe pain and suffering are not foreign to Christian faith, but central.

    Of course, this is an interpretation of Jesus life, death and resurrection that I reject. It is also an interpretation that I believe has done a lot of harm through the centuries. I think it is impossible, yes, impossible, if you read the Gospels, to make the case that God wanted Jesus tortured for the sins of humanity. But that is an interpretation that has sometimes been made in the history of Christianity and the social and political fallout has been, and is today, that torture is OK, maybe even more than OK. This Pew finding may just be another in a long line of horrible historical examples of that.

    --------

    Susan Brooks Thistlethwaite is the former president of the Chicago Theological Seminary (1998-2008), Thistlethwaite is a senior fellow at the Center for American Progress.

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How sad to read these

How sad to read these statistics. The Bible teaches "do unto others as you would have done to you" and yet I know of no one who would want to be tortured. ~~ Lane Baldwin - alifewithspirit.org


How can you be Pro-Life AND

How can you be Pro-Life AND Pro-war???


Thanks for this

Thanks for this article. The point in paragraph four, though, makes no sense, because the pain the Jesus endured to "save humanity" has nothing in common with the pain inflicted on those who are (unfairly and illegally) tortured, since the pain of one voluntarily practicing Christianity is wished for, and has "redemptive potential" behind it (it's positive), whereas the torturing of non-Christian "terrorists" is involuntary and does not result in their being "saved." It is merely humiliating, punitive and has no ultimate value other than enjoyment and satisfaction for the (demented) torturer - certainly captive Muslims who are tortured are not elevated religiously (converted) because of their torture! This is sloppy thinking. It's too much thinking, IMO. I think it's fairly obvious that Christians are pro-torture for two reasons: 1) Christianity is not based merely on New Testament content, i.e., it constantly invokes Old Testament "law", which is loaded with themes of religiously justified violence and bitter retribution (against infidels and nonbelievers), and 2) Christians, as undereducated and crass as they prove themselves [to be] again and again, automatically assume that Moslems are [always] the ones being tortured, and for them that's a good thing, an extremely good thing.


Many of us in

Many of us in "post-Christian" Europe have been shocked by the blood-thirstiness and hypocrisy of "Christian" America - invading Iraq unilaterally and using torture and barbaric behavious (Abu Ghraib). And by Goebels-like double-speak claiming waterboarding is not torture when it has been a staple torture in many countries condemned by the US! Perhaps worst of all is last week's revelations that extremist Muslims were tortured to get them to "confess" a link between Saddam and Al Qaeda proclaimed by Vice President Cheney that never existed! Truly Hitlerian! The worst Bush era hypocrisy: claiming all this was done in the name of Christ!


this is a very interesting

this is a very interesting analysis and makes sense when examined.


David S. is closest to the

David S. is closest to the overall truth regarding Christians and torture. However, this discussion has to go further. BTW: this posting is written by a Christian who claims the 'born again' experience. The fact that many Christians embrace a 'whole Bible' theology is due to a theology of the Bible that is based on a unified concept that the Bible doesn't really provide. While it may be very true that Christ can be 'found' in the OT, that does not suggest that the NT and the OT are entirely or necessarily compatible. In regard to Jewish culture and religion, yes. But in regard to what is God's vision for the behavior of his Chosen, no. Faith cements the two testaments, not elements of nationhood. In the OT, conservative Christians in the U.S. find their alternative Zion as interpreted through their understanding of the historical meaning of the U.S. Therefore, they feel justified in being able to compartmentalize their world into two parts, physical nationhood and spiritual church. Thus, the statements in the NT about the role of government are stretched beyond their real context into teaching that elevates citizenship into an equal status with faithfulness, i.e. the faithful Israelites. This thinking has given way to what we are seeing in the poll. Christians' deep identification with the political world has allowed them to rationalize behavior by a nation that goes completely against the teachings of their Lord.


The history of Christianity

The history of Christianity is loaded with violence and blood, unfortunately. This especially is true when it's twisted for political reasons. Examples are the abuses of both the Papacy and right-wing Protestants through the generations. For people who support a humanistic Christianity, it's sickening. A little off-theme but scary: the overall numbers of people who approve of torture in this poll. Yes, it shows: a dictatorship is possible here.


Gracious sakes! They didn't

Gracious sakes! They didn't ask me; and I go to church every Sunday and attend every church function my Protestant congregation schedules.


There is no conflict between

There is no conflict between "pro-life" or "pro-war" or "pro capital punishment". This was once explained to me because I was similarly "confused". "Pro-life" is all about protecting the "innocent" life. Pro-war and pro-capital punishment is all about exercising just judgement over the "guilty". So - clearly, this debate cannot be won rationally.


Totally consistent with

Totally consistent with other attitudes and behaviors, be it around issues of child care and welfare, food stamps, the death penalty, and all the other "rights" that some people have and that many feel should be taken away. The whole Right to Life movement is not so much about the right to life but about punishing those who engage in sexual behavior, IMHO. If they cared about the born as much as the unborn, it would be more believable. Not using frozen soon-to-be-destroyed embryonic stem cells is simply one more example of this disconnect, since we know that stem cell research will one day lead to some truly amazing cures. The bible teaches people to close their minds so that they do not have to think much about things and so that people obey god-directed leadership without questioning why...


Ummm..... I think that the

Ummm..... I think that the shocking thing about this article is that 42% of non-religious people ALSO support torture. The fact that the difference between believers and non-believers is less than 10% is the real shocker. I think that there must be something much deeper in American culture today that permits torture, and that it cannot simply be because of religious beliefs. John Crane Prague, Czech Republic


As said by a previous

As said by a previous writer, fervent Christians tend to be among the least educated, except for their leaders (who are passing out the collection plates). What can we expect from people who do not question anything about their religion. No church goers in the KKK of course.


The greatest tyrants the

The greatest tyrants the world has known - Hitler, Stalin and Mussolini - all ran on a Social Democratic Party Platform, preaching brotherly love and taking care of each other, as opposed to personal responsibility and personal choice regarding contribution and service. These men, early on, exhibited great charm and charisma - the women and men in the audience wept, like groupies. Then a remarkably short time later, by some miraculous horror, they found good reasons to kill large numbers of people (those who betrayed the 'revolution'). The top Nazis were in fact famous for writings about preventing cruelty to animals and against hunting - Hitler himself being vegetarian. There is a time for love and a time for hate - those are facets of the human heart - when a person or group tries to pretend that one of those emotions does not exist, it grows into a disease state and leads to the most abominable behavior human beings are capable of. Let's focus our anger with the light of truth - call your congressman today and support H.R. 1207 and audit the Federal Reserve Bank - don't be distracted by any natural flu pandemic hysteria, attacks on the mainland or whatever other emergency might distract us. Remove the parasite from this nation while we still have our life-blood.


Maddave interjects: In

Maddave interjects: In times not-too-far-past fundamental christians (sic) burned - actually roasted - innumerable heretics, witches, infidels, et al at the stake with no pity whatsoever. They reasoned that suffering at the stake was but a minor warm-up in preparation entering the eternal fire and brimstone of hell, so these few moments of pain were entirely inconsequential to the victim . . . but served as a vivid preview for the faithful of what God has in store for the unfaithful.


What percent of non

What percent of non church-goers approve of torture? I would like to know what would happen if the question were asked the same way of those who don't go to church, and then compare the statics.


What else can you expect

What else can you expect from the folks that brought you the Inquisition?


I really think this article

I really think this article is a stretch. Why focus on the pain of the crucificion, passing by the doctrine of Hell? I'd argue instead that churchgoers are just better and more willing rationalizers. Those who WANT to have prisoners tortured will find a way to rationalize some sort of justification. The religious do that sort of thing more easily than the nonreligious, because that's what religion is... presuading yourself to actually believe incredible things that you WANT to believe.


I am not a bit surprised.

I am not a bit surprised. Nearly all Evangelical Christians that I have known have been selfish, hypocritical, horribly judgmental people who think that people who don't believe as they do are beneath them and not worthy of the same rights. If these people actually met Jesus on the street they would likely shun him as a freaky hippie.


Within the first week of

Within the first week of both Basic and Infantry training it's instilled in the young soldier that he/she is protected under the Geneva Convention against torture. That gives consolation if not a feeling of gratitude to such a young person, as indeed it did me. Today most veterans believe these rights (should) exist whether they do or not and promote them when among each other. Sadly of 60 million youth who came of age during the Vietnam War less than 2 million actually served, and many of these former are the very ones who now profit from war. Neither torture nor war should exist unless americans in general including the blind and disabled ALL serve......even the blind can answer phones and do laundry. Either we ALL serve in this country or NO ONE should serve. Then watch torture take on a higher level of relevance. Until mandatory service hits america forsquare in the forehead, such talk has little relevance to the average light thinking 'american.'


I think I know why these

I think I know why these opposing attitudes intersect. It has been my observation, since 911, that the conservative mind thinks in two distinct ways. First, though I don't believe in absolutes, they see things as black or white, for or against, right or wrong, with little or no grey ares. Secondly, where this article come-in is the belief that the ends justifies the means. To that ends people believe it is o.k. to torture if it has a noble purpose.


Mel Gibson's "bloodfest"-

Mel Gibson's "bloodfest"- and its huge success- should offer us an explanation for the encouragement of "the sadist" at the core of EVERY "control freak" movement... and Abrahamic religions are Nothing, if not "control freak" movements... ^..^


I believe the logic is

I believe the logic is similar to where a jury of alcoholics might acquit a person accused of drunk driving manslaughter because they sympathize, and a jury of social drinkers would not. More importantly, we are not talking about Muslim-style torture where they behead, cut off body limbs, whip with chains, etc. I would guess 99% of Americans are opposed to that. Here we are dealing with making people so uncomfortable that they actually reveal plans to kill Americans.


If one read Eric Hoffer's

If one read Eric Hoffer's The True Believer, it becomes plain why the True Believers enjoy torturing. It is self-hate, directed at others under the mask of holier than thou. Reborn or inborn, the fundamental mind is a sick mind. Have you noticed in history, every time God ruled, Man got screwed!


Not only the Roman Church

Not only the Roman Church with its Inquisition went in for torture and murder of "heretics" - the Calvinist branch of the Reformation were up to it as well. The New England Puritans used public torture and hanged Quakers and "witches".


We need only to look to the

We need only to look to the Catholic Inquisition to as proof of the authors point. Incidentally Gibson's film on the passion is a lie from beginning to end and in no way reflects the reality of Christ;s true 'passion'. The term "the Christ" is also invalid when used in reference to Jesus. "The Christ is an abstraction: a conceptual approach the His existence and is a denial of His humanity and His divinity. Its mare a term used by New Agers and the like. Gibson's film also overemphasized Jesus suffering as a human being, while making no comment or valid statement about His divinity and omitted, not only the Virgin Birth, but also the Ascension. So where did Mel Gibson’s “Jesus” go after his dubious resurrection, resuscitation and/or recuperation from the crucifixion? Perchance to the South of France with Mary Magdalene and their child? His conclusions about Christ lead one to follow the path straight out to the Merovingians ! ala Dan Brown's trumped up inventions in the fictional DaVinci Code, replete with all of its Merovingian nonsense. Be mindful as well of Gibson's primary influence in the making of the 'Passion' none other Anne Catherine Emmerich, the psychic Augustinian nun whose hallucinations spoke to Gibson’s more heretical inclinations, which led him to equally heretical conclusions in the making of the film itself. “The Passion of the Christ”, like Brown's Da Vinci Code is a FICTION based loosely of real events, but whose intentions are far from truthful. Pay heed Mel Gibson...........For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works. (II Cor. 11:13-15)


It seems that few

It seems that few evangelicals subscribe to Truthout. Given the vituperative nature of many of the opinions being expressed in this forum I begin to understand why. As an obviously 'undereducated' evangelical Christian it grieves me that a caricature should be posited as the mainstream of evangelical belief, thus feeding the antipathy and widening the divisions that separate us.


This would be obvious to

This would be obvious to anyone that pays attention to these alleged "Christians." It's about authoritarianism, not Jesus. Knowing your "right" and making others do what you say, and making others do what you say.


Jesus warned us about false

Jesus warned us about false 'believers' like these.


When I was a kid, the big

When I was a kid, the big thing for Christians (Presbyterians as a kid, Southern Baptists as a teen, lots of searching as an adult) was John 3:16 (For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, etc). As I understood that, it was about God's pain of seeing his son die - which any parent who's lost a child will tell you is one terrific sacrifice. Where's the mega-church that teaches what I understood about a loving God and a Jesus who was supposed to be an example? Wasn't Jesus supposed to be our teacher, not the Romans? Maybe people who don't believe in torture don't go to church so much because they don't want to hear about how it's okay to torture. From my point of view, there's more Christ in Christmas than there is in Christian nowadays.


I've read so many differing

I've read so many differing "opinions" here. Amazing as we are as a species - we are so far from any kind of salvation (whatever that might be) - and fervant belief seems to hold us back the most. I am personally inclined to believe we have moved past the time of taking someone elses word for how we should be, behave, belief, treat others etc. - perhaps that was appropriate 2000 years ago? If there is redemption for the human soul it must be in learning to distinguish what is right and what is wrong for oneself - we need to live as adults, not infants - otherwise we will stay controlled by those who would exploit us with for their own ends! I don't think it is unreasonable to postulate that the bible has been frequently tampered with by numerous generations of (sometimes) cynical individuals. Do you really have any idea of what or who or if Jesus was? and what he represents (or perhaps represented) to the divinity? If you do then perhaps you are confusing your divine aspirations with the divine itself? If you are one of us (humans) who cannot see for themselves, perhaps just open your eyes to your own humble humanity!


Why do the followers of

Why do the followers of Jesus approve of torture? Mark Twain had the answer: 'It is believed b y everybody that while [God] was in heaven, he was stern, hard, resentful,, jealous, and cruel, but that when he came down to earth and assumed the name Jesus Christ, he became the opposite of what he was before: that is to say he became gentle, merciful, forgiving and all harshness disappeared from his nature and a deep yearning love for his poor human children took its place. Whereas he devised hell and proclaimed it.' [Letters from the Earth] The torturers are following in their Master's footsteps, practicising what He repeatedly preached would be the eternal fate of any one who didn't believe 'in his name.' Of them it is said "The smoke of their torment ascendent for ever and ever, and they shall have no rest day or night. " [Revelation]


Jesus' entire ministry on

Jesus' entire ministry on earth was about kindness, forgiveness, taking care of the poor, etc. Read the Sermon on the Mount, the two greatest commandments, "let he who is without sin cast the first stone," "turn the other cheek," the use of bread and wine at the Last Supper instead of animal sacrifice, and many other examples throughout the gospels. It was not until several hundred years later that Sts. Paul, Augustine, Irenaeus and others taught vengeance, punishment, penance, etc. If Jesus were alive today, he would be the biggest critic of those who distorted His teachings.


Some will abuse religion for

Some will abuse religion for political gain regardless of the costs.


Not surprising when one

Not surprising when one considers that the cross, the symbol of their faith & object of their veneration, is a Roman instrument of torture. It is not a coincidence that the iconic image of American atrocities at Abu Ghraib is that of a hooded man standing on a box with arms outstretched as in crucifixion. As for the biblical teaching of "Do unto others..." No one screams "injustice" louder than Americans when that which they consistently do unto others is done unto them. No evil act is beyond their ability to justify with expressions of 'good intentions' or 'deep regret'..... Hypocrisy & credibility do not coexist well.


Jesus would not have

Jesus would not have tortured, condoned torture, advised torture, nor tolerated anyone to be tortured if He could prevent it. Somewhere in those dusty, ancient times He learned that logic problem: "The Ends Never Justify the Means". It's too bad the Church that declares itself in His name never did.


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