Iraq War Vet: "We Were Told to Just Shoot People, and the Officers Would Take Care of Us"

by: Dahr Jamail, t r u t h o u t | Report

Iraq War Vet: "We Were Told to Just Shoot People, and the Officers Would Take Care of Us"
(Image: Lance Page / t r u t h o u t; Adapted: The U.S. Army, K. OS, whiteblot)

On Monday, April 5, Wikileaks.org posted video footage from Iraq, taken from a US military Apache helicopter in July 2007 as soldiers aboard it killed 12 people and wounded two children. The dead included two employees of the Reuters news agency: photographer Namir Noor-Eldeen and driver Saeed Chmagh.

The US military confirmed the authenticity of the video.

The footage clearly shows an unprovoked slaughter, and is shocking to watch whilst listening to the casual conversation of the soldiers in the background.

As disturbing as the video is, this type of behavior by US soldiers in Iraq is not uncommon.

Truthout has spoken with several soldiers who shared equally horrific stories of the slaughtering of innocent Iraqis by US occupation forces.

"I remember one woman walking by," said Jason Washburn, a corporal in the US Marines who served three tours in Iraq. He told the audience at the Winter Soldier hearings that took place March 13-16, 2008, in Silver Spring, Maryland, "She was carrying a huge bag, and she looked like she was heading toward us, so we lit her up with the Mark 19, which is an automatic grenade launcher, and when the dust settled, we realized that the bag was full of groceries. She had been trying to bring us food and we blew her to pieces."

The hearings provided a platform for veterans from Iraq and Afghanistan to share the reality of their occupation experiences with the media in the US.

Washburn testified on a panel that discussed the rules of engagement (ROE) in Iraq, and how lax they were, to the point of being virtually nonexistent.

"During the course of my three tours, the rules of engagement changed a lot," Washburn's testimony continued, "The higher the threat the more viciously we were permitted and expected to respond. Something else we were encouraged to do, almost with a wink and nudge, was to carry 'drop weapons', or by my third tour, 'drop shovels'. We would carry these weapons or shovels with us because if we accidentally shot a civilian, we could just toss the weapon on the body, and make them look like an insurgent."

Hart Viges, a member of the 82nd Airborne Division of the Army who served one year in Iraq, told of taking orders over the radio.

"One time they said to fire on all taxicabs because the enemy was using them for transportation.... One of the snipers replied back, 'Excuse me? Did I hear that right? Fire on all taxicabs?' The lieutenant colonel responded, 'You heard me, trooper, fire on all taxicabs.' After that, the town lit up, with all the units firing on cars. This was my first experience with war, and that kind of set the tone for the rest of the deployment."

Vincent Emanuele, a Marine rifleman who spent a year in the al-Qaim area of Iraq near the Syrian border, told of emptying magazines of bullets into the city without identifying targets, running over corpses with Humvees and stopping to take "trophy" photos of bodies.

"An act that took place quite often in Iraq was taking pot shots at cars that drove by," he said, "This was not an isolated incident, and it took place for most of our eight-month deployment."

Kelly Dougherty - then executive director of Iraq Veterans Against the War - blamed the behavior of soldiers in Iraq on policies of the US government.

"The abuses committed in the occupations, far from being the result of a 'few bad apples' misbehaving, are the result of our government's Middle East policy, which is crafted in the highest spheres of US power," she said.

Michael Leduc, a corporal in the Marines who was part of the US attack on Fallujah in November 2004, said orders he received from his battalion JAG officer before entering the city were as follows: "You see an individual with a white flag and he does anything but approach you slowly and obey commands, assume it's a trick and kill him."

Bryan Casler, a corporal in the Marines, spoke of witnessing the prevalent dehumanizing outlook soldiers took toward Iraqis during the invasion of Iraq.

"... on these convoys, I saw Marines defecate into MRE bags or urinate in bottles and throw them at children on the side of the road," he stated.

Scott Ewing, who served in Iraq from 2005-2006, admitted on one panel that units intentionally gave candy to Iraqi children for reasons other than "winning hearts and minds.

"There was also another motive," Ewing said. "If the kids were around our vehicles, the bad guys wouldn't attack. We used the kids as human shields."

In response to the WikiLeaks video, the Pentagon, while not officially commenting on the video, announced that two Pentagon investigations cleared the air crew of any wrongdoing.

A statement from the two probes said the air crew had acted appropriately and followed the ROE.

Adam Kokesh served in Fallujah beginning in February 2004 for roughly one year.

Speaking on a panel at the aforementioned hearings about the ROE, he held up the ROE card soldiers are issued in Iraq and said, "This card says, 'Nothing on this card prevents you from using deadly force to defend yourself'."

Kokesh pointed out that "reasonable certainty" was the condition for using deadly force under the ROE, and this led to rampant civilian deaths. He discussed taking part in the April 2004 siege of Fallujah. During that attack, doctors at Fallujah General Hospital told Truthout there were 736 deaths, over 60 percent of which were civilians.

"We changed the ROE more often than we changed our underwear," Kokesh said, "At one point, we imposed a curfew on the city, and were told to fire at anything that moved in the dark."

Kokesh also testified that during two cease-fires in the midst of the siege, the military decided to let out as many women and children from the embattled city as possible, but this did not include most men.

"For males, they had to be under 14 years of age," he said, "So I had to go over there and turn men back, who had just been separated from their women and children. We thought we were being gracious."

Steve Casey served in Iraq for over a year starting in mid-2003.

"We were scheduled to go home in April 2004, but due to rising violence we stayed in with Operation Blackjack," Casey said, "I watched soldiers firing into the radiators and windows of oncoming vehicles. Those who didn't turn around were unfortunately neutralized one way or another - well over 20 times I personally witnessed this. There was a lot of collateral damage."

Jason Hurd served in central Baghdad from November 2004 until November 2005. He told of how, after his unit took "stray rounds" from a nearby firefight, a machine gunner responded by firing over 200 rounds into a nearby building.

"We fired indiscriminately at this building," he said. "Things like that happened every day in Iraq. We reacted out of fear for our lives, and we reacted with total destruction."

Hurd said the situation deteriorated rapidly while he was in Iraq. "Over time, as the absurdity of war set in, individuals from my unit indiscriminately opened fire at vehicles driving down the wrong side of the road. People in my unit would later brag about it. I remember thinking how appalled I was that we were laughing at this, but that was the reality."

Other soldiers Truthout has interviewed have often laughed when asked about their ROE in Iraq.

Garret Reppenhagen served in Iraq from February 2004-2005 in the city of Baquba, 40 kilometers (about 25 miles) northeast of Baghdad. He said his first experience in Iraq was being on a patrol that killed two Iraqi farmers as they worked in their field at night.

"I was told they were out in the fields farming because their pumps only operated with electricity, which meant they had to go out in the dark when there was electricity," he explained, "I asked the sergeant, if he knew this, why did he fire on the men. He told me because the men were out after curfew. I was never given another ROE during my time in Iraq."

Emmanuel added: "We took fire while trying to blow up a bridge. Many of the attackers were part of the general population. This led to our squad shooting at everything and anything in order to push through the town. I remember myself emptying magazines into the town, never identifying a target."

Emmanuel spoke of abusing prisoners he knew were innocent, adding, "We took it upon ourselves to harass them, and took them to the desert to throw them out of our Humvees, while kicking and punching them when we threw them out."

Jason Wayne Lemue is a Marine who served three tours in Iraq.

"My commander told me, 'Kill those who need to be killed, and save those who need to be saved'; that was our mission on our first tour," he said of his first deployment during the invasion.

"After that the ROE changed, and carrying a shovel, or standing on a rooftop talking on a cell phone, or being out after curfew [meant those people] were to be killed. I can't tell you how many people died because of this. By my third tour, we were told to just shoot people, and the officers would take care of us."

When this Truthout reporter was in Baghdad in November 2004, my Iraqi interpreter was in the Abu Hanifa mosque that was raided by US and Iraqi soldiers during Friday prayers.

"Everyone was there for Friday prayers, when five Humvees and several trucks carrying [US soldiers and] Iraqi National Guards entered," Abu Talat told Truthout on the phone from within the mosque while the raid was in progress. "Everyone starting yelling 'Allahu Akbar' (God is the greatest) because they were frightened. Then the soldiers started shooting the people praying!"

"They have just shot and killed at least four of the people praying," he said in a panicked voice, "At least 10 other people are wounded now. We are on our bellies and in a very bad situation."

Iraqi Red Crescent later confirmed to Truthout that at least four people were killed, and nine wounded. Truthout later witnessed pieces of brain splattered on one of the walls inside the mosque while large blood stains covered carpets at several places.

This type of indiscriminate killing has been typical from the initial invasion of Iraq.

Truthout spoke with Iraq war veteran and former National Guard and Army Reserve member Jason Moon, who was there for the invasion.

"While on our initial convoy into Iraq in early June 2003, we were given a direct order that if any children or civilians got in front of the vehicles in our convoy, we were not to stop, we were not to slow down, we were to keep driving. In the event an insurgent attacked us from behind human shields, we were supposed to count. If there were thirty or less civilians we were allowed to fire into the area. If there were over thirty, we were supposed to take fire and send it up the chain of command. These were the rules of engagement. I don't know about you, but if you are getting shot at from a crowd of people, how fast are you going to count, and how accurately?"

Moon brought back a video that shows his sergeant declaring, "The difference between an insurgent and an Iraqi civilian is whether they are dead or alive."

Moon explains the thinking: "If you kill a civilian he becomes an insurgent because you retroactively make that person a threat."

According to the Pentagon probes of the killings shown in the WikiLeaks video, the air crew had "reason to believe" the people seen in the video were fighters before opening fire.

Article 48 of the Geneva Conventions speaks to the "basic rule" regarding the protection of civilians:

"In order to ensure respect for and protection of the civilian population and civilian objects, the Parties to the conflict shall at all times distinguish between the civilian population and combatants and between civilian objects and military objectives and accordingly shall direct their operations only against military objectives."

What is happening in Iraq seems to reflect what psychiatrist Robert Jay Lifton calls "atrocity-producing situations." He used this term first in his book "The Nazi Doctors." In 2004, he wrote an article for The Nation, applying his insights to the Iraq War and occupation.

"Atrocity-producing situations," Lifton wrote, occur when a power structure sets up an environment where "ordinary people, men or women no better or worse than you or I, can regularly commit atrocities.... This kind of atrocity-producing situation ... surely occurs to some degrees in all wars, including World War II, our last 'good war.' But a counterinsurgency war in a hostile setting, especially when driven by profound ideological distortions, is particularly prone to sustained atrocity - all the more so when it becomes an occupation."

Cliff Hicks served in Iraq from October 2003 to August 2004.

"There was a tall apartment complex, the only spot from where people could see over our perimeter," Hicks told Truthout, "There would be laundry hanging off the balconies, and people hanging out on the roof for fresh air. The place was full of kids and families. On rare occasions, a fighter would get atop the building and shoot at our passing vehicles. They never really hit anybody. We just knew to be careful when we were over by that part of the wall, and nobody did shit about it until one day a lieutenant colonel was driving down and they shot at his vehicle and he got scared. So he jumped through a bunch of hoops and cut through some red tape and got a C-130 to come out the next night and all but leveled the place. Earlier that evening when I was returning from a patrol the apartment had been packed full of people." 

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Dahr Jamail, an independent journalist, is the author of "The Will to Resist: Soldiers Who Refuse to Fight in Iraq and Afghanistan," (Haymarket Books, 2009), and "Beyond the Green Zone: Dispatches From an Unembedded Journalist in Occupied Iraq," (Haymarket Books, 2007). Jamail reported from occupied Iraq for nine months as well as from Lebanon, Syria, Jordan and Turkey over the last five years.


Comments

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And here we go in

And here we go in Afghanistan, the same old shit !!!My god will we ever learn ?? Obama, bring our troops home !!!



"Just following orders" is

"Just following orders" is reminiscent of the excuse of many Gestapo foot-soldiers following the post-Hitler era.



I applaud those who returned

I applaud those who returned and told what I "hope" are true stories about the atrocities done in the name of America. Certainly the Iraqis and other Muslims know these truths, and based on them and our illegal incursion into Iraq will undoubtedly become our enemies in the future.

I think every American citizen should think about what would have happened during our Revolutionary War if the British and the Hessians had had access to such indiscriminate fire power and remote killing by drones.

Although I can find NO way to defend my country's intrusion into Iraq since it was almost entirely based on lies from the previous administration and a desire for oil and strategic base locations, I certainly understand a soldier's reaction to the possibility of death.

Obama, support the troops and bring them home now. Do not support the self-serving and imperialistic motivations that got us into this mess.



It is not the soldiers'

It is not the soldiers' fault.

It is our fault. The soldier's job is to kill people as efficiently as possible. That is what armed forces are supposed to do.

The Constitution gives Congress the exclusive right to declare war; i.e., to send soldiers to kill people.

We elect representatives to Congress in order to make that kind of decision in our name. The House of Representatives has the exclusive right to fund ---or de-fund--- wars and all other federal activities.

Those are the basic facts. I don't care if the war was never declared; if Bush did it; if Obama continues it; etc. They represent us, the American electorate (We, the People). So it is our fault that it has happened, and our fault if it continues.



War is...... a video game.

War is...... a video game.



The US has become as guilty

The US has become as guilty as the enemy! Self righteous in the murder and mayhem against innocents has created a shameful nation forever. There is no pride in fighting a war like a rabid animal, just a unforgiven soul to burn in hell for eternity.



Just keep track of how many

Just keep track of how many mid-level officers get promoted because they were willing to whitewash and cover-up these actions.



why does this suprise

why does this suprise anyone? As if this war would be "different". It's appalling, for years and years we've counted how high the bodies piled from US action, yet we're supposed to be shocked at sudden "new" articles highlighting typical conduct.



And the Republicans wonder

And the Republicans wonder why nobody likes nor trusts us.



I am so ashamed of my

I am so ashamed of my country. These atrocious actions by our troops will ensure that we will one day have the same kind of treatment done to us...and rightfully so. " Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." The government that not only condones, but encourages this complete evil against innocent human beings will suffer for it...mark my word. God will not be mocked. The Neocons that saturate this entire Administration are Satan's spawn. Hell was prepared for such as they.
This is Supposed to be a Christian Nation. What a lie the people are fed. This is the most evil nation on the face of this earth mainly because of it's Hypocrisy. We say one thing and do the opposite.



As an Iraq veteran myself,

As an Iraq veteran myself, this article is full of holes, and I fisk it here, if anyone is interested:

http://www.shieldofachilles.net/2010/04/un-truthout.html



By the way, why are we still

By the way, why are we still in Iraq? Why are we still waging war on Afghanistan rather than just hunting for bin laden? Why did bush decide not to hunt for bin laden?

I'd like a conservative reading this to respond.



So John Roham, Your argument

So John Roham, Your argument is that we shouldn't believe this article because the witnesses are OTHER SOLDIERS who disagree with you? I checked out your link and that's what it appears to say.

Why should we believe you over another group of soldiers when they happen to have solid evidence to back up their claims (like this video that the military admits is real)?



Dear god, what have we

Dear god, what have we become? During the second world war German soldiers were told that if they were going to surrender, to surrender to an American. They knew they would be treated fairly. Now, to keep the price of oil down in the US our military has become a blood drooling monster. These kids raised on video games where no real blood is spilled even in the most horrific slaughters now show the same behavior in real combat. A decade of desensitization on a video screen. This is not accidental. With Texas now the boil on the ass of a failing education system in all states these poor kids going into combat are the dumbest of any generation. And they behave like it while carrying lethal weapons. This too is not an accident. During the Viet Nam conflict we in the Marines were told that we could refuse an illegal order, such as shooting at civilians. What have we become?



Can we get out the black arm

Can we get out the black arm bands yet?



The people who are behind

The people who are behind this are the same who will tell you how great their God is and how benevolent he is. So, just how does their God justify these acts? Well we know God created the United States of America in His image. Exactly which god to these soldiers and marines pray to at night before they go to bed? It must be Mars, the god of war because is sure isn't any Christian god I ever heard of.



This country will soon pay

This country will soon pay the bill for its murderous arrogance. Enjoy the last remaining years of your fading power and do not be surprised to be treated the same way you've been treating other people throughout the planet.
usa is a nation of hypocrites, violent and undereducated...the shame of mankind.



slaughter? check out the

slaughter? check out the storming of jerusalem by the crusaders,this isnt news



Will it take God to bring us

Will it take God to bring us to justice?



I wonder if Any American

I wonder if Any American Propagandist News organisation will note the Irony on the day when American Famailies and thier Children are being blown up in Cafes, Malls, Subways, and Starbucks - When the video tape is played of the Militant commander UBL saying . Sorry it Was "The Fog of War"

U.S.A.! U.S.A.! Happy trails Cowboys



The longer this goes on, the

The longer this goes on, the closer we get to the end of the US empire. The more of this we can disclose, the more conscious the world becomes of the criminal and unrepentant, brutal and inhumane nature of US imperialism. This will not stop because the US government decides to stop. This will stop when the people of the world unite in solidarity behind each and every people and nation that the US invades, occupies, rapes and brutalizes. Take whatever action you can take now in solidarity with the peoples of Iraq and Afghanistan. Remain vigilant and act too on behalf of our brothers and sisters in Latin America whose turn, in the bloody and cyclical nature of US imperialist attention towards our "backyard", has come again. We must not permit the US government, military and CIA to destabilize the myriad experiments in people's power currently underway in Latin America.



when faced with this kind of

when faced with this kind of degeneration;
I cant help wondering where it would stop...
Where it came from..
It never left US
and left to our own device
It wont



"share the reality of their

"share the reality of their occupation experiences ... ". But they are killers.

When Israel captured Adolf Eichmann years after the Second World War, just about everything that Eichmann said was... " I only obeyed orders." Israel put him on trial, and then hung him.

In the US they 'share their experiences'. Is this nation rotten to the core? From the President to the foot-soldier.



This, folks, is exactly what

This, folks, is exactly what war is all about. This is always what war is about. Who are we kidding? We needn't feign surprise and outrage.

Yes, this is horrific, especially to those who have been blind to what's really happening "in our name." But it is war itself that should receive our attention, not specific acts that sometimes get forced into our consciousness.

I have no way to know what my reaction would be under a similar situation. I think The Universe that I should never have the occasion to find out that I could be frightened enough to do the exact same thing.

There are never any winners in a war.



And who said Bish-Cheney&C°

And who said Bish-Cheney&C° didn't know squat about history?I am proud of my govt. for applying and teaching the very efficient methods promulgated by the NSDP and their armed branch the SS,; we are, proof in hand, their rightful heirs. I just hope that, as before, the same road is followed...to a war crimes tribunal!



If not now, when? If not

If not now, when? If not you, who? It IS time to take back our country. We MUST be the change we wish to see take place.



Obama will never end these

Obama will never end these pointless wars because he is a puppet on a string and too many congressman/senators/contractors have too much to lose cash wise.

The U.S. has never been the 'guys in the white hats'.

We are totally rotten to the core and the only apparent thing that will end ALL of this, will be the financial collapse of the United States.

By then, it'll be waaaay too late.
And the sheeple will say, "wha hoppened?"

May God help us all.



I hope my buddies on 2nd

I hope my buddies on 2nd tour make it back alive and we can leave there. We are not winning haerts & minds right now.



thank you for taking this

Dahr,
Thank you for taking this another step forward in the information game.  It's clear that our media has "sort of" covered it.  They HAD to.  And the Pentagon has admitted that it IS an authentic video (they HAD to).  But, according to the Pentagon, they cannot find the original video (really?)
Once again, like you always do, you take it to the next level, the level that brings us closer to understanding the larger picture of war and war's mechanics, and the role of our governments in it (regardless of whether they are Democratic, Communist, Socialist, or any other aberration of them.

The one unifying factor seems to be the SIZE of any given government, regardless of their societal beliefs.  The larger a government grows, the more corrupt it gets.
What I see in your work is that you always follow up on the initial videos or reports of human rights abuses and war crimes, and begin to expose the roots of these crimes against humanity.  It's imperative that those of us who want to see an end to wars and militarism as a national culture, dig in deeper to see what lurks behind the initial reports.

I know damn well why I support your work every month, and I hope others will consider supporting your work on a regular basis as well.  Here's how:
http://dahrjamailiraq.com/donate

And please also donate to Truthout.org:

https://www.truthout.org/support/donate.php

 
 



Before US began the Iraq

Before US began the Iraq invasion, did Americans support the war? The answer is YES. During Bush's re-election did Americans support the war? The answer is YES. Why many countries tried to prevent the war? Did US listen to them? Did anything change since that? NO.



This article is a total

This article is a total bum's rush, and is wholly unsubstantiated by fact and objective "reporting". Just another cheer piece that caters to one specific point of view.

Congratulations on accepting all of this at face value. A shame 95% of it is false, but what use are facts when they derail a perfectly good agenda?



i hope the usa will liberate

i hope the usa will liberate my country!



Yeah, Apache, what use ARE

Yeah, Apache, what use ARE facts when they derail a perfectly good agenda? Like the facts that Iraq was never a threat to the US and that Big Oil wanted control over Iraqi oil reserves ever since they were nationalized in 1972 and that the illegitimate 'administration' lied repeatedly to justify the occupation and that the corporate media ignored or belittled the millions upon millions here and worldwide who protested at some risk this warmongering insanity and that uncounted thousands upon thousands have been butchered in service of future profits?



Dear "Apache Driver": Could

Dear "Apache Driver":

Could you be a little more specific about how this article is a "bum's rush"?

The Pentagon openly admits that it uses good-ole propaganda techniques to convince people that the unpopular wars our government is engaged in for the oil industry are secretly in our best interests too.

But, even the Pentagon says this video is real and that all the facts are basically accurate. What facts are you privy to that dispute what we can see with our own eyes, hear with our own ears, and come directly from the Pentagon itself?



"i hope the usa will

"i hope the usa will liberate my country!"

Don't hold your breath. Every time some of us REALLY DO want to liberate a country our republican leaders are up in arms about how we can't afford to be "policing the world" or engaged in "nation building" (Bosnia, Haiti, Somalia, Rwanda, etc.) Maybe you don't remember the 1990s.

In the 90s some republicans were actually honest enough to admit that the difference between Kuwait vs. Bosnia and Haiti was that Kuwait had some "resources" for "us".



I'm sure many of those

I'm sure many of those soldiers are scared shitless. Put yourself in their position, fear that anyone could be a threat. You're likely to pull the trigger just as fast if not faster than these soldiers. When you're in combat and you see what looks to be a friendly person suddenly pull out a gun and take out your buddy next to you you'll have the same mind set these soldiers have. Is it a horrible situation? Yes. Bring those soldiers home.



It's hilarious reading all

It's hilarious reading all the posts of the people who simply sat behind their computers or desk or whatever while other people, who are just like them, were sent off to fight a war.

You people are disgusting, you have no idea what it is to be over there I honestly believe you useless people would have done some of the same exact things.



This video made me

This video made me physically ill, I am ashamed to be an American. If I could actually afford to relocate my family, I would.



I hope our military

I hope our military commanders see these types of things and realize how real time errors do cost human lives. Do we need better tech? Better men? Better policies? Or has this always happened in every large scale warfare since the advent of the flintlock pistol? Just like a man who might accidentally run over a child in a cross walk, sometimes he can get away with it. Tragic? Yes. Mathematically avoidable? No. Not to say this needed to happen. There were no WMDs and we were engineered into this conflict. Where are those responsible? Where is the justice? Just imagine if we were invaded and this was allowed to happen on U.S. soil.



Setting aside the disturbing

Setting aside the disturbing question of why, the fact is that you deluded sick individuals WANT this to be the truth. Shame on you.

No. Stop. Just stop. Really, you are wrong and sick and should be ashamed.

Here's a reasoned, thoughtful analysis from a credible source: http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/georgepacker/2010/04/truth-but-not-the-whole-truth.html



This is why I watch videos

This is why I watch videos of american soldiers being blown up and shot and laugh.



Stop this false Left vs.

Stop this false Left vs. Right paradigm!!! Please stop!

First you must admit that you are not invincible from manipulation, brainwashing; and you are not safe from being lied to.

Please wake up.

We as a human race are in trouble.

You have to realize that what you think you know, what you believe - may not be correct.

Love is the way.

Learn your physics, learn your mathematics, learn you history.

Investigate!
Investigate Operation Northwoods
Investigate Operation Mockingbird
Investigate The Gulf of Tonkin
Investigate the CIA
Investigate the FBI
Investigate FEMA
Investigate FEMA camps
Investigate the Mena scandal
Investigate Iran-Contra
Investigate Continuity of Government
Investigate 9/11
Investigate The Bilderburg Group
Investigate The Council on Foreign Relations
Investigate The Trilateral Commissions
Investigate David Rockefeller
Investigate The Rothschild Family
Investigate Sibel Edmonds
Investigate Colleen Rowley
Investigate Henry Kissinger
Investigate Zbignew Brzezinski
Investigate The Downing Street Memo
Investigate World Trade Center Building 7
Investigate Nano Thermite
Investigate Architects and Engineers

Love one another.



Pretty sad aint it. Thats

Pretty sad aint it. Thats the US mentality, if it moves, shoot it! Lou 



What's this? (from THE SAME

What's this? (from THE SAME video)

http://proudprimate.com/resources/weapons-x-7.wmv

It's a God-damned RPG, ain't it?

Sucks when the truth gets in the way of your agenda, doesn't it?



We need to leave

We need to leave Afghanistan. These are the kind of stories that were coming out of Vietnam making people realize it was not a war that was "winnable" in the way we were approaching it, and that it was not a place we wanted to send our sons and daughters.



Pro-Military shills, ghouls,

Pro-Military shills, ghouls, and warmongers sometimes post comments on Truthout. These people worship guns, bombs, military tech, and killing, and they support US wars of occupation and aggression against small countries. They think of killing as a sport. They love their power trips, their swaggering jackboots, and their blood lust. These are the same people who go out in the woods armed with spotlights, night vision goggles, and high-powered rifles, shooting defenseless animals...and they call it a sport. Hitler's boys were the same, as all war loves share basic characteristics, the main ones being a total lack of conscience, heart, and empathy. These bizarre redneck monsters walk the earth highly paid by our tax dollars, murdering innocent civilians, showing up on progressive websites to defend the indefensible. May the earth one day be cleansed of this evil.



After many years of

After many years of inbreeding and education cuts the United States government finally got to try the experiment that they've been waiting since the war of independence for.

First you run the trusty old false flag op., this will sway public opinion in your favor, albeit temporarilly...

Whilst the nation is in mourning for its sacrificial lambs, announce that this was all caused by -rouge state- and that the head of said -rouge state- was responsible.

Remember to call any whistle blowers unpatriotic liberal socialist scum to discredit their genuine point...

That is of course-

The real enemy is at HOME, terrorism is a goddamn IDEAL, you cannot fight an ideal, no more than you can fight the tide.

Sure makes for a nice excuse to start wars of convenience tho huh?



To blame is on the soldiers

To blame is on the soldiers and call it murder is just plain ignorance. First off, they are in a war and they are there to find the enemy and kill them if they are armed. From the video and their vantage point it looks like they have weapons. the only reason WE as viewers know it is a guy with a camera is because the video pointed it out to us. The solders don't have tech to say "hey its a camera not an rpg" Second, your mindset changes when you are in a war, your in a kill or be killed environment. If it looks like an RPG and it is an RPG and you don't shoot first, you risk the lives of yourself and your comrades. they had to make a choice and it was the wrong one. But, all the soldiers acted in a professional manner leading up to the attack. they check with superiors multiply times if they can engage before engaging. yes, some solders made off the cuff remarks, but at that point in time they thought they took out enemy soldiers and were still feeling the high of accomplishment. even with the kids they still thought they were with enemy soldiers.

with all that said i do think its horrible that the commanders after the fact tried to cover it up. everyone knows there is collateral damage in war. them lying afterwards and trying to cover it up is what the issue is. Not the event itself. watch the video again, the soldiers did exactly what they were trained to do.



Does anyone else notice a

Does anyone else notice a pattern of the right-wing troll comments coming in waves?

THANK YOU MYSTERIOSO!

Thank you for, not only serving in the military, but MORE IMPORTANTLY, for somehow managing to maintain your humanity and sense of right and wrong.

Thank you for managing to put it in perspective rather than spending the rest of your life congratulating yourself and feeling self-important around other people who didn't take part in the killing.

Thank you for realizing that killing people for private interests doesn't give you a special privelege to free speech that civilians lack.



Also, THANK YOU MYSTERIOSO,

Also, THANK YOU MYSTERIOSO, for making the b.s. coming from the pentagon cheerleaders who have been trolling this thread more obvious.

Thank you for not making a big freakin' deal about the fact that you're a combat veteran - like other posters.

Your tone reminds me of my Dad (who is a WWII veteran). It’s of someone who's actually seen a good deal of the worst combat up close in a way that forced you to face your humanity and ask questions. The pro-pentagon “veteran” posts here seem to be from people who are either lying about their "service", or didn't take in enough of the horrors of their actions to grow up and realize that war isn't a game for puffed egos, but organized mass murder usually perpetrated by people who have no interest in American values other than the value of the almighty dollar.



Spam? SPAM? WTF. I write

Disappointing though. You'd expect more from a modern army such as ours. But don't think that only Americans act this way. Anyone could have broken down in their morals and ethics. Especially during war when everyone is trying to survive. And we call ourselves human. Cuz this is what it's meant to be human.



Disappointing to say the

Disappointing to say the least. And then they wonder why there is so much hatred towards Americans. Yeah... and why did the US invade Iraq? Insurgents? Terrorists? And now Afghanistan. Terrorists right? How about N. Korea? They have nukes right? That's pretty terrorizing. And why now Somalia? They have their pirates. Terror of the seas.

If you're gonna call this a "war on terror"... be prepared for a never-ending war. You can't fight this way, blowing everything that moves. You can just kill everyone but then that would cause anger elsewhere and your "terrorism" would spread.

There has to be something behind this "war on terror." Notice that they're not fighting terrorism wherever it shows up. They simply choose what country would be most beneficial to them. Not too beneficial... Yeah. A country not too strong, with terrorist threats, resources [If they invaded China then it would be a much bigger deal hmm? Or perhaps Russia..].



Oil...... people say that

Oil...... people say that it's a war for oil. No, they're not forcing their way in physically, loading up their trucks with oil and then profiting off it. After the occupation in Iraq the americans had already set everything up. The oil companies had already invested and made their moves when there was chaos. Capitalism... smh

Notice how in Western Europe they have such awesome health insurance. FREE! and they pay for the taxi back.



Communism. Not communism.

Communism. Not communism. But influences of it. After WW2 Russia held Eastern Europe. That's how Poland got its communism [came back to being a liberal democracy though, looking up to America smh..}
In W. Europe, they feared communism because it appealed to the people, and was a threat to capitalism. So it was competition. Like how one retailer had cheaper prices than the others to lure in customers. Countries like Britain and France made free health care to compete with the communists in the east.

Now America however... was waaaaaay across the Atlantic Ocean. No influence. Nobody to compete with. The greedy capitalists stayed. And so they want their oil now.



War? Hells yeah. I have

War? Hells yeah. I have never seen of a more profitable business than it. Even if there is only a little bit of war you can go all out and use up all the ammo you have. Don't worry, we'll just buy some more: From our capitalists back home. Arms production is very profitable, yes. And never ends as long as there is war. War on terror my ass. A country that looked like it needed invading from the point of view of everyone else in the world and had terrorists... Good excuse. Terrorists. So only a few countries were warred upon to use up the production of arms back at home.
The world wars? WOOT said the Americans. Notice how late they came in both wars. Very few casualties. But the allies needed those weapons to fight back the Nazis riiiight?Here ya go, just pay us back later, with interest. Henry [Ford]. Made trucks and cars for the Nazis.



Rofl. Don't think that this

Rofl. Don't think that this country is any better or worse than the others. Anyone could have done that. But because we stick ourselves everywhere the chance for something like this being caught is higher.

That's no excuse though. Those in charge and the ones that did the shooting in the video "Collateral Murder" should be punished. But that's not gonna happen.whitewash. =[



I... trailed off.... >.<

I... trailed off.... >.<



Maybe if we stopped jerking

Maybe if we stopped jerking off over WWII our military would stop acting like the only thing needed to win a war is MORE DAKKA.



Hey don't go 'nam on these

Hey don't go 'nam on these kids!

They doing their best...y'all be there and youre brain would also be scramble eggs, easy hard.



The white satanic beast!!!!!

The white satanic beast!!!!!



Wow. A lot of you guys are a

Wow. A lot of you guys are a little nutty.

If you blow up the video, these guys did have weapons, of which American soldiers were in the area. You only see a small section of the video. These guys could have been running from a cache or something.
News reporters die all the time in war. We have lost a lot of our own. There is a video of the Georgean war of Russian troops firing at retreating Turkish News Reporters. You can see the Russians and bullets going through the window, but no one notices that?

Don't bring your kids to a fire fight.
This is called war! Honest and deliberate mistakes happen. These guys are trained to kill and kill they will when ordered to do so.

Guess that no one has seen "Battle of Haditha" Now that is fucked up shuff right there.

Why is America the bad guy here when Saddam killed Millions of his own people, and millions of Iranians?



04:51 — Anonymous "Why is

04:51 — Anonymous

"Why is America the bad guy" - Why are we there right now, by the way? If this was about saddam, why did OUR OWN government HELP him kill thousands (not millions) of his own people? Why are we not at war with at least a dozen other countries right now, torturing and killing innocent civilians to "liberate them" from THEIR despotic rulers?

"News reporters die all the time in war" - yeah, and some of them are killed on purpose, because they refuse to be embedded.

If YOU blew up the vidco and found weapons, you really should tell the Pentagon, because the Pentagon says they were unarmed. Once again, apparently you're privy to exclusive information that even the Army is unaware of. As it stands, the Pentagon, grudgingly, disagrees with you, not us.

Who said that just because we notice American attrocities that we don't notice Russian attrocities? We aren't at war with Russia. Do you really want to stoop to the level where we're being compared to Russia? Do you really want to play that card?



"Don't bring your kids to a

"Don't bring your kids to a fire fight." These people didn't know they were IN a "fire fight". You mean "Don't let your kids be born in Iraq", or "Don't bring your kids to a massacre"

Here's another empty slogan for you to repeat mindlessly, "Don't bring a CAMERA to a gun fight". If only they knew their cameras would be so useless against bullets, they could have come more prepared, to the "gun fight" they couldn't have run away from if they tried.

Yeah, we've "lost a lot of our own" - by the way, why?

bin laden's not in Iraq and HATES the Iraqi people as much as he hates us. For some reason, bush knew he was going to attack and let it happen, because he wanted to invade Iraq even before he took office. Why?

It's ok to come clean and accept the REAL reason why we need to kill and torture innocent people. This ISN'T Russia and bush is out of office, so no one will arrest you for openly admitting that this is a colonial war. That's why mccain said he wouldn't mind if we stayed there for 100 years. He estimated it would take us that long to SQUEEZE out every last drop of black gold lying under those people's feet.

It's a land rush and the Big Oil Cartels have staked their claim.



04:51 — Anonymous Don't

04:51 — Anonymous

Don't put words in our mouths. America is NOT "the bad guy". The bad guys couldn't care less about America. Remember, a Democrat is in the White House right now! Soon, you right-wingers will be dusting off that old chestnut you overused during President Clinton's term in office that goes something like this:

"I LOVE MY COUNTRY BUT FEAR MY GOVERNMENT!"

Remember that bumper sticker? For some reason, it magically disappeared from 2000 to 2008. Don't worry, it will make a huge comeback!

Just because I hate bush's colonial wars and the fact that Democrats are too scared to put an end to them for fear of being branded "unpatriotic" by people like you, doesn't mean I think America is "the bad guy".

Big Oil is NOT America. I LOVE MY COUNTRY AND WOULD WILLINGLY DIE FOR IT - BUT NOT FOR EXXON.



It seems absurd to me that

It seems absurd to me that we are still occupying Afghanistan and Iraq for our self defense. We'll never find all the terrorists or stabilize the region will we? Now they are even moving to Pakistan but the mountains and cities could hide these guys easily if they just lay low...we can't stay forever. Heck we can't even find Osama.

We accidentally kill thousands of civilians and (loose thousands of our own) due to the nature of war -- which will create future generations of terrorists. We should rather provide food, water, clothes and get the hell out and spend even 10% of what we're blowing in wars on stepping up our defense at home such as checking inbound cargo and better border security.

I'm as scared of the next guy of some suitcase nukes getting set of in the US, but just like the drug war, this just ain't working -- it's just shooting our self in the foot.



A movie came out in the 50s

A movie came out in the 50s called Panic In the Year Zero. It's about survivors of a nuclear war killing each other for food. The main character is a man just trying to help his family survive. His son kills someone to defend the family and gloats about his kill. The father immediately yells at him and gives him a valuable lesson about war that many in our generation of video game warriors still hasn't learned.

He says, in effect, "I want you to do what you have to do because you have to do it and I want you to HATE EVERY MINUTE OF IT."

That is a true warrior's attitude. It's plausible that the people firing the bullets from, who knows how many miles away (so far that their victims didn't even know they were there) didn't know they were killing innocent people. What I find discusting is the dishonest overacting by people on these forums saying the victims WERE in fact armed, even though the Pentagon disagrees. It's also discusting to hear people "doing their jobs" and getting pumped over it like they just scored a 3-pointer. It's discusting hearing people try to blame the messenger for the fact that children were shot. The attitude that EVERYONE in Iraq is the enemy and there's no reason not to just shoot them all is also discusting. Even against the Nazis, our troops (who were FAR MORE battle hardened) knew the difference between the enemy and innocent civilians. Mistakes were made then too. They always are. The difference is the attitude that, the entire country who's throat is being crushed under our boot is the enemy for simply being under our feet.



Military training

Military training deliberately desensitizes the recruits.
It's been too long for me to remember the exact source, but I have heard recordings of trainees chanting awful chants about killing civilians and children. And as some have noted, violent video games help prepare the soil. (When my children were growing up they were not allowed in our home)Add fear and bad leadership and the results are tragic. And counterproductive from the point of view of fighting terrorism. Though if your aim is control of geography and of oil, now maybe it is different.



After this war only one

After this war only one lessen can be learned that if you are a country without Nuclear Bomb get yourself a bomb or you will end up like a Iraq Afghanistan.
Or Nuclear Bomb specialist have a moral obligation to protect the country's dignity and to help others to do the same.
First nuclear bomb to japan been long time and people forgot easy.
Maybe to save the world from nuclear madness and avoid the invasion to other countries one small nuclear bomb to one of the cities in USA would motivate the politicians lift their games?



Kinda makes you reconsider

Kinda makes you reconsider who the real terrorists are, doesn't it?

It's not a war ON terrorism, it's a war OF terrorism.

Seems to me the only true terrorists are the ones committing unthinkable murders all in the name of fighting the notion of those very attrocities. "War" has always been a playground for experimentation - whether it be military weapons or studies of social conflict. The sick mentality of any military is disgusting in itself but the twisted myopic perspective of a population that dismisses such actions in the name of war is what really disturbs me.

Hate begets hate. But some days I think it would be interesting to see how people would feel if such unfettered killings were brought to their own homes. So arrogant we are.



Corporate America is to

Corporate America is to blame.

Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Corporate America has become absolutely corrupt.



I want the US's military

I want the US's military money (and China, Russia etc) AND I want to give some to the Mprize scientific research foundation that is currently supporting over 50 university researchers world wide in fixing (repairing) the aging process. (they were featured on 60 min TV show in 2006), how else are we to stop this ever increasing waste of our money, the constant drumbeat of war bankrupted the USSR and the US empire is not far behind. Check out the upcoming movie "The singularity is near" (out this year), the Mprize and Aubre de Gray is featured, also check out the maxlife foundation we are really getting close to major advancements in nanotech and biotech. Time to stop killing people in war and do something constructive. Longevitymeme is also a good site to keep up to date on breakthroughs.



Depleted uranium shells will

Depleted uranium shells will continue killing generations of irakies long after the USA leave Irak, exactly like Agent Orange is doing in Vietnam.Sleep well USA is protected.



This sounds a bit over the

This sounds a bit over the top. And as always with the fog of war, we are only getting part of the story. Why are we hearing about this only now? No other media organization has never heard this?

A little ridiculous...



If they didn't want to be

If they didn't want to be massacred, they shouldn't have let saddam have all those weapons of mass destruction



lets take down the concrete

lets take down the concrete barriars and come home and let them get back to the sos shites and sunnis killing each other



@Anon 13:10 - This is NOT

@Anon 13:10 - This is NOT new. Soldiers have been telling these stories for years, the media ignores them! There have been Youtube vids of US soldiers shooting unarmed civilians and LAUGHING. Please get over the "American = good" crap. Neither our government nor our military has had an ounce of good intention for 50 years.

Soldiers are fair game and they know it. The Iraqis should do whatever they need to to get what's left of their country back.



What weapons of mass

What weapons of mass destruction? Saddam was dis-arming according to UN Resolutions and the USA "leaders" knew this but had to keep Americans thinking just the opposite. Meanwhile, the nation that provoked this outrage, Israel, is guilty of violating over a hundred UN Resolutions dating back to its inception in 1949!

ANYONE killed in this war is a crime because the war itself was a MAJOR crime against humanity. It was not a mistake, but a deliberate attack on an innocent people fueled by the real terrorist and troublemaker in the Middle East, Israel.

The same scenario has been going on towards Iran and we may face yet another cold-blooded slaughter of innocents, this time leading to WW3!

Americans are not blame for these crimes but the special interests who profit by war are. America is addicted to war and hate and ignorance! God help us all!



This is the way the US

This is the way the US military has conducted business since the wars against the American Native populations. As shocking as it is it not surprising, nor is it surprising that the genocide of millions of men women and children on our own ground is still conveniently forgotten as we wonder how these modern soldiers minds were warped. The guiding principle of the US military is extreme cruelty and all this propaganda about the odd child getting fine medical attention from US docs etc. is willful ignorance of the historical facts of how the USA was created.



Erik--you are right,war &

Erik--you are right,war & circuimstances do this, we might have done the same under the same ugly circumstances, made even UGLIER by the fact WE HAD NO REASON TO BE OVER THERE. & we keep encouraging the shiite-sunni differences b/c while they kill each other out of frustration, it suiits our purpose, WE continue to STEAL from them. US GO HOME. & ApacheDriver would be better called SlaveDriver. & who says only the US can haveWMD? Like who put us in charge--or maybe the better question is:for how long?



"Military training

"Military training deliberately desensitizes the recruits"

That's why billion of dollars of our military budget (our tax dollars) goes directly to Hollywood and the video game industry. The reason video games portray enemies as monsters and shows exaggerated blood splattering is that the sources of the money want our children to see the enemy that way, and want our children to get off on the splatter they might get to see first hand later if they're lucky. In other words, the desensitization training starts long before they're even in military.

That's why bill o'reilly said he hoped terrorsists would bomb the city of San Fransisco (because it passed a city ordinance forcing recruiters from indoctrinating children in its public schools).

The philosophy of the conservatives who purchased Iraq and Afghanistan with our money and lives is much like the traditional cliché of men in the South,

"Get 'em while they're young"



Frances Griffin, You said,

Frances Griffin, You said, "Military training deliberately desensitizes the recruits":

That's why billion of dollars of our military budget (our tax dollars) goes directly to Hollywood and the video game industry. The reason video games portray enemies as monsters and shows exaggerated blood splattering is that the sources of the money want our children to see the enemy that way, and want our children to get off on the splatter they might get to see first hand later if they're lucky. In other words, the desensitization training starts long before they're even in military.

That's why bill o'reilly said he hoped terrorsists would bomb the city of San Fransisco (because it passed a city ordinance forcing recruiters from indoctrinating children in its public schools).

The philosophy of the conservatives who purchased Iraq and Afghanistan with our money and lives is much like the traditional cliché of men in the South,

"Get 'em while they're young"



ReDiscover911.com The

ReDiscover911.com

The horrors arise in lies of Biblical proportions.

Mossad--not Muslims--did 9/11. The seed of the poison tree is also poison.

Rediscover911.com



whole2th: I don't think it

whole2th:

I don't think it matters if the 9/11 attackers were Muslims. Personally, I think they were just as "Muslim" as little timmy mcveigh was "Christian" when they committed their murder suicide.

The problem, as I see it, is in the fact that bush KNEW they were going to attack and he even knew WHEN, but INTENTIONALLY did nothing to stop them, because he knew he could manipulate people into a state of fear so they'd be ready to kill anyone from the Middle-East on site. The reason was that he NEEDED to get at that Iraqi oil and he NEEDED to get a pipeline built in Afghanistan. Iraq didn't attack us on 9/11 and neither did Afghanistan. bin laden did. What ever happened to him by the way? bush didn't care and neither did any of his buddies who've "made a killing" on this colonial effort.

Persoanlly, I think the best place to find bin laden would be in the basement of his daddy's (bush's friend's) palace in Saudi Arabia. I've even heard he needs dialysis, which I imagine is hard to get in even the most modern of caves. I don't think bush caused 9/11 but I DO think that one of his best friends did and bush, INTENTIONALLY did nothing to stop him. When bush's buddy attacked America he did bush a big favor, because the only person who hates America more than bush's buddy is bush himself.

Now be a good little cog and stop questioning what you're told.



Will Moon release the video

Will Moon release the video of his sergeant differentiating between a civilian and an insurgent?

I think recent events have shown that Americans MIGHT read an article, but they'll definitely stop and watch a video; especially if it's controversial.

It's important to release enough media to make our cause unignorable.



Unless this thread is about

Unless this thread is about sea mammals or misunderstood Beatles tunes, Truthout is falling asleep at the wheel and allowing spam again.

The spam filter rejects valid comments but lets the walrus king through?



Unfortunately, this is the

Unfortunately, this is the face of war. Although this article represents some of worst, to believe that a counter-insurgency is any type of neat clean-cut operation is denial. I do not seek to justify or condone any of our actions, but in war both sides are equally ruthless and equally cruel. There is no getting around it.



I WANT TO DRINK BLOOD AND

I WANT TO DRINK BLOOD AND EAT FLESH OF EVERY American soldier and I WILL



The trolls are out

The trolls are out tonight!

I think the Walrus commenter has struck again. The stupid canibal troll is probably the same person as the stupid walrus commenter. He's probably also one of the "veterans". I was the one who asked earlier if anyone else noticed that the troll commentary seems to be coming in waves.

Too bad TRUTHOUT IS ASLEEP AT THE WHEEL!



22:56 — Anonymous You're

22:56 — Anonymous

You're right. War is a ALWAYS a nasty crime against humanity. That's why you'd better have a pretty good reason to be engaged in it in the first place. What's ours?

That's also why you'd better make sure you don't raise a generation of barbaric citizens who consider the Age of Enlightenment to be the enemy. Children should be raised to have empathy and a conscience. Without that, all the fake religious posturing in the world is meaningless.



Don't know why you're there,

Don't know why you're there, getting these kinds of orders? - BECAUSE THATS WHAT THE ZIONISTS WANT AND YOU ARE THIR PUPPETS.

The US has long been hijacked by Zionists using US power for its own ends - when are you guys going to wise up?

Do YOU have an Israeli "Advisor?"



Putting aside for just a

Putting aside for just a moment the fact that both the Iraq and Afghanistan wars are illegal wars of aggression that should never have been entered into in the first place this is a perfect example of why insurgent wars are unwinnable. All the insurgents have to do is to provoke over reaction which they invariably do because of every human beings instinct for self preservation. The result of course is that the war cannot be won because the people are never won over when they are indiscriminately attacked by the occupying force. If the occupying force refuses to over react and takes the subsequent massive losses involved in insuring that the only people killed on the other side are actual insurgents actively involved in acts against them the war still becomes unwinnable because of the cost of those losses both in the military sense and in the political cost back home of absorbing losses on that scale. The rational course of course is to not enter into these types of wars to begin with and if you notice, the ones who began this one are the ones that avoided fighting in the last one, Viet Nam



Maybe you people need to see

Maybe you people need to see your cities in ruins, columns of refugees on your roads, refugees camps in your fields, your nation's symbols felled and strangers occupying your ground...
Perhaps you should know how we feel when the half of your family are collateral damages ? how it is to receive a bullet in the head when you're praying to your god ? To fear the death comming from the sky ?
Perhaps wouldn't you inflict this to other people then.... ?
War is a wound, not a "video game".



I think you're making a big

I think you're making a big mistake if you think the U.S. is on Israel's puppet strings. Who do you think funded Israel's weapons (AND WMDs)?

Israel is OUR puppet. If there was no oil in that region we couldn't care less what happened to Israel. I would be left ot its fate.

Its existence is due to the fact that the international oil cartel considers it a a "stabilizing force", by not having any oil of its own, being on the sea, NOT being a safe haven for Muslims who don't seem to understand how much we really just need the oil, and its willingness to carry out orders from Washington to do things that Americans would never want to done in our name.

Think of them as a mean little pit bull trained by the U.S. to attack the neighbors. Or, think of them as secret branch of the U.S. military that doesn't have to play by any rules.



I can't help notice that

I can't help notice that these incidents are three years old. Wonder if anything has changed since then?



APPALLING, OUTRAGEOUS,

APPALLING, OUTRAGEOUS, CRIMINAL, UNACCEPTABLE. This is all done in the name of regular Americans, folks, I hope this much is clear. It will not stop until we, in very large numbers, demand an end to this madness. So let's get on the horn people!



My story was better

My story was better



Pure Bullshit from an Anti

Pure Bullshit from an Anti American piece of shit!



You know, this article

You know, this article stinks of propaganda. I in no way support the Iraq War and I am a GWOT Veteran of the United States Marine Corps. This drivel, spewed by a few possible criminals (if what they say is true and they didn't report the incidents), is all hearsay and unverifiable. People who hate the USA or the military just glom onto idiotic bullcrap like this article to justify their own perceptions.

I know way too many good people who fought and risked their lives, doing their duty the right way to think this is widespread, if any of it actually happened outside of the wet dreams of some attention seeking former military member.

Iraq was a mistake, but to sit there and blame the people who fought their for what happens in war in stupid. Do you think the enemy gives a crap about our women and children? Probably not, if they good CNN coverage.

Sincerely,
Patrick
retired Gysgt USMC.



.....and we're supposed to

.....and we're supposed to win the hearts and minds of these people and install democracy ? Good luck! This nation is failing not only it's own people but people around the world. We wonder why the U.S. is hated. These stories won't make the mainstream news media(s) in America....but they do elsewhere in the world !I'm a Vietnam area vet (army) and people have forgotten the Mi Lai massacre. It's almost fifty years later and and it seems that we're still making the wrong decisions and doing the wrong things and trying to get away with it .....because we're Americans!



No wars in the world have

No wars in the world have not been soldiers wars. Every war has been power's wars. There are bunch of people to end up taking control of big armies and when they get a chance to use that power to either destroy the enemies or take control of more parts of the worlds, they do.



Anyone who believes this

Anyone who believes this crap and doesn't read other accounts is an idiot.



Fight them over there so we

Fight them over there so we wont have to fight them here. Well that simplistic full-of-shit rallying cry not only destroyed whatever goodwill the amerikan empire had over seas but now amerika itself will be subjected to these "kids" coming home after being turning into killers. The streets of the USSA will be red with the blood of innocents as veterans who will not be able to return to normal civilian life kill for the fun of it and since they will not be able to control themselves. Well done to the little scrub and the big dick. Their legacy will also include the deaths of thousands of homeland amerikans .



Fight them over there so we

Fight them over there so we wont have to fight them here. Well that simplistic full-of-shit rallying cry not only destroyed whatever goodwill the amerikan empire had over seas but now amerika itself will be subjected to these "kids" coming home after being turning into killers. The streets of the USSA will be red with the blood of innocents as veterans who will not be able to return to normal civilian life kill for the fun of it and since they will not be able to control themselves. Well done to the little scrub and the big dick. Their legacy will also include the deaths of thousands of homeland amerikans .



There's no doubt that many

There's no doubt that many soldiers engaged in atrocities out of fear, vengeance, or under direct orders. Please don't forget that there are many, many soldiers who shot out tires when told to shoot at all Taxis in a city. Soldiers like the ones described above who ignored occassional potshots from areas filled with civilians, and other soldiers who showed great bravery by not reacting in ambiguous situations until they were sure what was happening. War messes with your head. Only in retrospect are we able to look back and judge our actions in combat from a different perspective.



I am a United States Marine

I am a United States Marine Corps veteran who has done several tours in Iraq. I have been on hundreds of patrols in both Iraq and Afghanistan.

I have seen Marines kill civilians. It happens. It is war. I can say that not a SINGLE one was intentional. Oftentimes we have put our lives at far more risk than most would consider wise, in order to prevent as many accidental killings as possible.

It is easy for all of you to criticize, or read stories from the safety of an armchair that are exaggerated or one-sided and then imagine we are all bad people.

I have run across open fields through machine gun fire in order to reach an Iraqi boy who had been shot by insurgents. Am I a bad person? I have seen many more stories like this one. There are thousands upon thousands of stories like it that you never see.

The American military now is the most disciplined, restrained, and MORAL militaries in all of history. Do accidents happen? Yes. Have there been bad people in the military? Surely. But before you criticize from your armchair, try to take these cherry-picked, biased stories with a grain of salt. Based on my experience, this stuff, if true, is by far and away the exception and not the rule.



Where is the change Obama?

Where is the change Obama? Looks exactly the same to me? I guess that money under the table makes it easier to sleep and those promises harder to keep. Don't worry, in our two party system, the common people are always the losers. The iraqis and afghanis are paying a terrible price, and our politicians are creating more enemies to war with tomorrow. America's children have a heavy burden.



I call bullshit on this

I call bullshit on this article.



It's wonderfully revealing:

It's wonderfully revealing: that the lead role of ZIONISM in US-Israeli belligerence toward the Middle East passes so little noticed as to not even be mentioned in the commentaries about the Wikileaks video.
The actual process on the ground in Iraq has nothing to do with any US fears or interests, or with traditional American values; US ‘Rules of Engagement’ have slipped into a reality of genocide and extermination, under standard US disregard, to exactly suit the purpose of the one and only concerted Western intent: the openly-stated Zionist drive for Jewish supremacy in the Middle East.
A small but highly organized minority of US citizens (many with ‘dual’ Israeli citizenship) can easily determine the outcome of any election, when the majority has been bamboozled into misplaced trust. Those who want to participate in any actual efforts to reverse the drive toward global war must begin by audibly opposing our unconstitutional taxpayer-support for the open-air ethnic-cleansing of PALESTINE.
Those who oppose ‘war’ or ‘the war’ must realize that PALESTINE is, and has always been, the pilot-light of the whole thing.
The futility of anti-war efforts has been assured by the failure to notice this, and that is great news, because a plain, highly effectual answer can be applied at any time: we must simply begin to audibly protest the use of our taxes to finance any and all policies of ethnic or religious prejudice, by anyone involved in the Israel-Palestine problem – the same as we tell our children we would do, and the same as we do everywhere else.
This ordinary sense, having escaped Zionist dumbing-down, would quickly lead to a peaceful - EGALITARIAN - Israel-Palestine and an end of Zionism.



To Erik who falsely claims

To Erik who falsely claims he was sent off to war while the rest of us sat behind our computers, all I can say is BS. You joined like an idiot and went voluntarily. Others, like me were drafted back in the 60’s and we still have more right to state our disgust for war.



U.S. Army Veteran speaking -

U.S. Army Veteran speaking - All I want and have ever wanted from my military is protection FROM foreign invasion.

Bring the troops home now!



BS on this story. The writer

BS on this story. The writer gives everyone with a gun a black eye. What a liar.
This writer is a fool with an agenda. You want to believe fiction there are plenty of movies and books available, go entertain yourself with something more credible that this crap.



Perhaps "truthout" should be

Perhaps "truthout" should be changed to "rumorout" or "pretendout" if it's going to keep recycling the same refuted propaganda told by the same discredited individuals who've already been caught lying about their "first hand accounts" and experiences. Sure smells like Jesse MacBeth in here...



I agree, we should

I agree, we should definitely bring our troops home. However, I believe what we are seeing is the result of a combination of factors rather than a deliberate gov. policy. Rather, I believe we are witnessing the disintegration of our officer's corp as they face the prospect of fighting an endless, unwinnable war. In addition, as a former infantryman in VN, I found myself willing to shoot first and ask questions later. After all, you're alive, whether they were a combatant or not.



It appears the article of a

It appears the article of a delusion has given flight to the voice of stupidity and inspired posting by fearmongerers. That crap about Palestine being a center of gravity for the whole thing is beyond stupid. Please try to wrap your brain just around the facts and don't take leaps that you don't have the cognitive ability to make.
Facts
Saddam Hussein al-Majid al-Tikriti was responsible for the murder of Approaching two million, including between 150,000 and 340,000 Iraqi and between 450,000 and 730,000 Iranian combatants killed during the Iran-Iraq War. An estimated 1,000 Kuwaiti nationals killed following the Iraqi invasion of KuwaitOver 100,000 Kurds killed or "disappeared". No reliable figures for the number of Iraqi dissidents and Shia Muslims killed during Saddam's reign, though estimates put the figure between 60,000 and 150,000. (Mass graves discovered following the US occupation of Iraq in 2003 suggest that the total combined figure for Kurds, Shias and dissidents killed could be as high as 300,000. Okay pretty much somes up bad guy that should not be left in power. If there was a country in the middle east that had a spine and would have come to the aid of the Kurds and Kuwaiti's we wouldn't be there.
It is the responsibility of all nations to come to the aid of the oppressed and those under threat of genocide. Iraq was not a mistake, it remained something that was unfinished since 1991 and thank God we had a leader with a spine, willing to stand and risk all for others.



These are mostly lies,

These are mostly lies, including those by the named soldiers. Since it reflects the worldview of left-wingers, they willingly swallow it, regurgitate it, reproduce it, frame it, and then point to it.

By where is the skepticism? Even the tiny bit of inquisitiveness? If these soldiers are "brave" for speaking out, then why aren't they brave enough to name their superiors who allegedly gave them these orders? Americans don't take orders easily, including soldiers. If these stories were true, 1) thousands of soldiers would be tripping over themselves to back them up, and 2) many would disobey the obviously illegal orders.

Instead, most of the soldiers who are aware of these stories are calling them lies.



This, honestly, makes me

This, honestly, makes me want to vomit.



The real question is why are

The real question is why are we there in the 1st place . . .
Once you accept that we are, in fact, there (still there 7 years later!) - then it's all moot.
Having done scores of reports of survey and line of duty investigations ... it looks like they pilots did all the right things.
Guys on the ground reported bad guys with guns.
Pilots saw guys with RPGs and guns where the guys on the ground said they would be.
Pretty cut and dried.
Sucks to be the photog ... such is the price for chilling out with the Mujahideen.

I have worked this account, very intimately, since it all kicked off in 2003.
I call bullshit to most of what this website offers.
There are not "a lot" of videos of soldier misbehavior out there.
Why?
Because there is not a lot of soldier misbehavior going on over there.
There are a few bad apples, and most of those bad apples have been disciplined.

There is FAR more police misconduct in NYC on a daily basis than there is misconduct on behalf of the 100k soldiers in Iraq.

You can see whatever you choose to see if you look hard enough.

It's easy to be the armchair quarterback from 1/2 way across the world ...



These soldiers are cowards

These soldiers are cowards with guns. Nothing more than that. To any of you involved in this shit, I'd love to meet you without a gun and show you how a real american thinks of your cowardly bullshit.
Support our troops my ass. Fuck you all and I hope a roadside bomb takes you out you fucking cunts.



Bush and Cheney need to be

Bush and Cheney need to be in prison,
they lied to everyone invaded a country
that did nothing to us.
Why are they not in prison?
These two cowards and liars should
be held accountable for all this mess.
Like every military you have great soldiers
then we have bad. All countries have
them in their military. WE must become
a nation of respect and do what is right
whether we are home or abroad we must
lead by example that is how a great nation is built.
God I pray no more wars, they just take lives.



Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip

Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war



And we wonder why Middle

And we wonder why Middle Easterners hate us?



Whoever calls our soldiers

Whoever calls our soldiers cowards is
not correct. The are not cowards,
it is war. They really don't know who
the enemy is or isn't. They get wounded
and killed by roadside bombs.
War is awful and they have to protect
themselves. Do not call our soldiers
cowards they are very brave for what they
do and they are not forced to join.
But they must and they have to live.
I won't judge them I have never been to
war and I am not brave enough to want to.
They are!!!!!!



I only wish that all of you

I only wish that all of you that believe all of the BS that you read could be sent to Iraq, weapon in hand, to straighten it out. I am sure you will all be able to tell the difference between a bag of C4 and a bag of groceries at 200 yards.



I am willing to bet most of

I am willing to bet most of this is untrue. How many of these troops who enlisted willingly are still in the service? How many stories have actually been vetted and verified, showing that they not only were where they said they were, but when? People don't just die at US Military hands and there not be a record of it.

The killing of unarmed civilians who do not pose a demonstrable threat has never been permitted, and I tire of the "truth" purveyors who use lies and exaggerations to get print coverage.

There are enough good things going on in the middle east with our troops to provide good solid, truthful, and interesting stories of heroism and compassion that junk-bond salesman like Dahr Jamail should be out of business. But truth, though stranger than fiction, is harder to sell because you can't coat it in blood flavored hyperbole.



What rubbish. I had 2 tours

What rubbish. I had 2 tours in Iraq, and I never witness anything like this. Violence yes, but not like the author statee. This is just more leftest propaganda as far as I am concerned. Sounds like false reporting by MSNBC or the wacho rag Huffington blog



@Sunday 04/11/2010 -02:15

@Sunday 04/11/2010 -02:15 Anonymous (not verified)
I'll tell you where you can find me in D.C. I'll be happy to meet you. I won't have a gun, or mace or anything else. Come and let me know how you REALLY feel, internet tough guy. Please reply to my post and I'll be happy to share my email for you to get in touch with me.

I'm a 28 year old formerly active duty U.S. Marine and I am willing to meet you. I am not a meathead or a criminal, I get along with everyone, including the people whom I fundamentally disagree with.

I'll be happy to meet you in D.C. and if it turns out that we can come to an understanding, I'll show you some of the landmarks in the City



I think the Pentagon is

I think the Pentagon is right to exculpate the soldiers following ROE in the video released by wikilinks.

It's not the soldiers fault. They are soldiers; this is war.

The blame belongs to the authors of the Rules of Engagement, and those who must approve them.



The war in Iraq was never

The war in Iraq was never intended to be won, so the industrial war machine can continue making huge profits. So when things wind down in Iraq, just continue in Afganistan. Simply as that.
Make enough enemies so you can continue to fight, that's whats happening here.
I used to admire the USA, I was blind , now I see.
Harbour the seeds you sow, they say. I guess there is plenty of action to come.



Okay, this is pretty damn

Okay, this is pretty damn messed up. I live in the USA, and I don't agree with any of this going on at all. That being said, it also pisses me the hell off that other countries can call ALL of America evil... considering that the US is fairly large and comprised of people from all over.

A lot of us do not agree with this war. A lot of us also support other countries. We donate to charities in times of crisis, even while we are suffering... many of us are without healthcare, home and jobs, but we still reach out a hand and a heart to other people in their time of need. Yet, other countries that are well off never try to help us. That is something that is never talked about. Do not just judge us on the government/military aspect. That is something that is out of our control.



We are all sinners. Stop

We are all sinners. Stop looking to the Internet for answers you will never find.



Don't bring the soldiers

Don't bring the soldiers home. They are murders who will be bringing their psychopathic behavior with them, Baby killers all.



And we call them "HEROES"

And we call them "HEROES"



I stand by my military and I

I stand by my military and I stand by
America. If you don't stand behind them
then why don't all of you who judge then
walk in front of them.
They do not know who is going to kill
them and who isn't. This is war for
Heaven's Sake. They are not murderers,
Bush and Cheney are. Prison for them
both! Our military went because Bush
and Cheney sent them on lies.
We have the greatest men and women serving our country. If you don't like them then trade places with them and
see how far you get. I bet you would be
killing everything in sight.
Get behind them and love them and love
the USA!!
They now have a Commander and Cheif
who cares about them and tells them
the truth, no liars and cowards like
Bush and Cheney! Prison I say Prison
for them both!!!



America is creating enemies

America is creating enemies in many outside countries. America should not worry about any terrorist that hate America from the outside, but should worry about the Americans that hate America from the inside, their citizens. If these criminal crimes are covered up by higher command, then it IS known and is still trying to hide it, then the whole Govt. is complicit. Including the Commander in Chief.



For all who have served and

For all who have served and are serving,
I respect you and you are all HEROES in
my book!!! Don't let anyone tell you
anything else. Please don't listen to all
this baloney on here.
If the they don't like it they can get out
of the USA and leave.
You are doing what you are told to do
and you are doing it bravely and I am
very proud of all of you.
How can you know who is going to hurt
or kill you in WAR, you cannot.
To all of you who judge them, well what
do you want them to do, walk around
with no guns and just let anyone kill
them. We are at war!!
Do not let them be treated the way
you treated the Vietnam soldiers,
I was very young when that happened but
when I learned and saw what the American people did to them I cried.
The are fighting for you and your families. Stand up and be proud of them.
If not get the he-- out of the USA!!!!
Mistakes are made in war and that is a fact. It is their life or the enemies.
Do not judge them!!



"And the Republicans wonder

"And the Republicans wonder why nobody likes nor trusts us."

You fool. Americans are despised regardless of political ideology. Bush Jr didn't magically turn your nation into one that was despised on the day he took Office. My father used to have a peculiar sneer whenever he talked about Americans. You were generally regarded as stupid and up yourselves (no-one here distinguished between party affiliation). It's now a sport however to make fun of Americans.. What with your lard arses dominating strip malls, your rubbish Education and Health system and your hate for one another, especially class warfare (Dems just as bad ad Repubs). You guys are easy pickings.

I'm not American. What frustrates me as an onlooker is how self-loathing/obsessed you collectively are. Well, except the Repubs but then they're just overly full of hubris. You all have benefited from the American 'Empire'. And that includes the rest of the West that rode off your coat tails since 1945. It's excruciating to watch so much hand wringing from many Americans.

What I do like about the Repubs (remember, I'm a foreigner) is that they are solid in their beliefs and what America represents (the sort of Hollywood propaganda that oppressed people believe in). It's no-nonsense and it's not broadcasting mixed messages. The Dems stand for too much introspection. They represent weakness. Now understand this. The world by and large still operates on 'might is right'. If you aren't assertive, if you aren't ready to double down (like you guys did in WW2), then be prepared for very tough times ahead. Now that China is starting to assert itself, it is going to start vying for global mindshare. It's already happening.

One more thing. You guys are super good at running yourselves down. As a citizen of a 'middle power', I'd rather U.S (flawed though it is) retain its position in the world rather than a strong yet aggressively obnoxious sans checks and balances, China.



ANY war is greatest crime

ANY war is greatest crime against humanity and whose who make decisions about IT and during IT are war criminals. Pure and simple. With no stratus of limitations. Yes we have to investigate all what happens to us, and start from most recent and most outrageous.

Stop right where we are now. Look around. Here are 10 questions about WHO ARE THEY:

• What's going on?

• Who are our real enemies?
• Who want to dictate what others must to do?
• Who want to prosper with total disregard to suffering of others?
• Who acting from behind the scene and hope it will last forever?
• Who evade ANY responsibility for their actions and decisions?
• Who making decisions about our own life?
• Who plan, encourage, promote and conduct modern slavery in its most outrageous form?

• Why we closing our eyes for all these questions?
• Is suicide our destiny?

I reserved two lines in case I missed something. It can be dozen. Or more… You can add your own. But do something. Don't hide your head into the sand in naive hope it will pass by. It will not…



It's mostly true, and those

It's mostly true, and those who say it isn't are lying.



Want the truth read Nate

Want the truth read Nate Fick's " One Bullet Away" or "Generation Kill" written by Evan Wright. The level of civilian deaths depends on the type of enemy you are fighting and your instructions from your commanders. We were not prepared to fight an urban guerrilla war. And our instructions to our troops on how to assess when to fire was woefully inadequate. Don't forget we are dealing with 20 yr old kids in a life and death situations, expected to make split second decisions in very hostile environments. Civilian deaths are always a component of any war and one of the reasons that many believe wars of choice (not necessity) are wrong.



Just a professional

Just a professional photographer jumping in here for a minute... To me, it seems clear that what the soldiers identified as an RPG was a camera with a long lens. That's how you hold gear like that. This isn't the first time that the US has killed journalists, or innocent civilians, in wartime. (Look up "Panama Deception" for just one example). I am a proud American but this video makes me very sick and angry.



Some of these things 'may'

Some of these things 'may' be true, BUT the same things happen in all wars - Italy, Germany, Japan. IN WWII in the Pacific, the ROE was simple - take no prisioner's. This was the result of the atrocity of Pearl Harbor and if any of these things are true they may be due to the Twin Towers payback.



No wonder America is in the

No wonder America is in the shape it is
in now. All hear is how terrible we are
and how our soldiers are so bad.
You are the ones who make me sick!
Get off our dead as---and go to war if
you think it is so easy to tell who is going
to kill you and who is not. America is
a great country. Bush and Cheney took
America down and look at the Tea Party
if they are what you want representing
America then God help us.
Palin is sick in the head.
Leave our military alone!!!
They are what is right with America,
oh sure they make mistakes they are
at war, the ones on here who think you
know everything and can judge them
well sign up and go fight. Then come
back here and tell me what hell is like.
If you put them down and America get
OUT!!!
You don't have to live here and you don't
have to be here.

I'm one American who is very proud of
our military men and women!!!
Stand up and salute them!!
If you cannot do that GET OUT!!!
I will keep saying it over and over and
over.
GET OUT!!!



WAR IS BEAUTIFUL!!! The

WAR IS BEAUTIFUL!!! The Iragis did alot of crappy things youll never hear about! Boo Hoo Hoo!! Fuck them, I dont feel sorry for them!



War IS terrorism with a BIG

War IS terrorism with a BIG budget ! The fascist boots of amerikan occupation are terrorism pure and horrid !



Nothing is wrong with this

Nothing is wrong with this video, everything looks perfectly fine. Of course after the fact, it turned out to be a mistake... but that is how it goes.



Our military is lacking in

Our military is lacking in professionalism, I'm an officer and I see poor behavior at all levels almost daily. The fact is that our military is vastly comprised from the lower end of our society. Families of means don't encourage military service as they did in the 40's and 50's. We tend to recruit from the poor neighborhoods and we have relaxed our recruiting standards to fill boots. What has developed is a a very ghetto mentality that is quickly becoming the new cultural norm in our armed forces. It's not uncommon to see off duty soldiers on base walking around with sagging jeans and looking like gang members, What we need is to increase our efforts to recruit a better class of indviduals to serve.



The cowards who enjoys war

The cowards who enjoys war may be able to tell us what any Iraqi, even Saddam Hussein, ever did to any American. Please google 'world's leading terrorist' and learn about who was the real threat to people around the world during the past eight years....

You know they won't bother. Facts just get in the way of the rah rah attitude that claims that the US can do no wrong. You betcha they're not in uniform themselves.

Proud of what? Kids who were told that going to Iraq was 'payback' for 9/11? More lies to get our men and women to kill and be killed for the war profiteers. So many homeless vets now...so many crippled and blinded and burned. For what? Oh, yes. Rah rah.

So sad that Americans can be so blind.



Why let truth get in a way

Why let truth get in a way of a good anti-american agenda?

http://www.shieldofachilles.net/2010/04/un-truthout.htm



There are assholes in every

There are assholes in every country but the U.S. of A. Let's just bomb ALL of them! Next we can murder ALL of our own journalists, intellectuals and free thinkers! Then the rest of us TRUE AMERICANS can get on with the business of managing WITHOUT intellectuals, freedom of speech, or freedom of the press! "Fuck them, I dont feel sorry for them!"

USA! USA! USA! USA! USA!

Seriously folks, it's getting more and more obvious that some of the people writing about this article have a particular pro-pentagon agenda that must be heard. I have a feeling some of them were paid to comment here. The Pentagon has openly admitted that it is engaged in that form of propaganda. Why should we believe Truthout is immune?

Also, to all of the people commenting in waves about this video, and all the facts of this article being untrue, DON'T TELL US. TELL THE ARMY. TELL THEY PENTAGON. THEY DO NOT DISPUTE THE CONTENT. THEY'VE ADMITTED THAT IT'S ALL TRUE.



The nazis who were just

The nazis who were just following orders ALSO showed incredible bravery and were not ALL bad people. To argue that the morality of war is about whether or not the soldiers, who are "only following orders", are brave, is to INTENTIONALLY cloud the issue.

If there is a reason why we are there tell me what it is. It has NOTHING to do with saddam. He's dead and when he committed HIS attrocities WE HELPED HIM. Are our attrocities any nicer than his? "He murdered his own people" - WOW! What an asshole! That's OUR job!!!!