Why We Should Take Jared Loughner's Politics Seriously
Friday 14 January 2011
by: Steve Striffler, t r u t h o u t | Op-Ed
(Image: Jared Rodriguez / t r u t h o u t; Adapted: HeyThereSpaceman., unforth, D Sharon Pruitt)
Jared Loughner, the 22-year-old accused of shooting Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and 19 others, apparently drew political ideas from the radical right and radical left, listing (fascist) Hitler's "Mein Kampf" and (communist) Karl Marx's "Communist Manifesto" among his favorite books. He was also attracted to conspiracy theories, thought we should be on a gold standard (because the government was trying to control us through currency), and at times just believed life was meaningless and nothing could be done.
Contrary to the prevailing wisdom, however, holding muddled political views does not in and of itself necessarily make Loughner mentally ill, unstable, crazy, or even particularly unusual. It makes him American and peculiarly so. In the college classroom, at political events and in grassroots organizing meetings, it does not take long to find many young (and not so young) people who hold what many of us consider to be an oddly contradictory collection of political views. After more than a decade of teaching, I can say that very few of today's college students have any sense of what "the left" or "the right" are or have traditionally stood for, what "liberal" and "conservative" have historically meant or where on the political spectrum we might place fascism and communism. When asked, most students - most Americans - "know" that Hitler and Marx are "bad," but very few can articulate what they stood for politically and many often assume that Nazi and Communist are synonymous.
Like Loughner, a significant portion of young people are, for very good reasons, profoundly anti-establishment, distrustful of anything they hear from the government or mainstream media. But this does not make them crazy anymore than it automatically leads them toward a coherent critique of the political system. Rather, in a world where fragments of information come from so many sources, it often leads them to the odd place where any explanation of the world is as good as any other, where there is no conceptual rudder for judging one theory or idea against another. Hence, they draw from wildly opposing political ideologies and are attracted to conspiracy theories. And it often leaves them in a frustrated place where public figures cannot be trusted, and to the conclusion that nothing can be done to change the world (except perhaps something chaotic and dramatic). Hence, the tendency toward apathy and (after a philosophy class or two) nihilism.
How the hell could we expect otherwise? It is bit ridiculous to ask why so few Americans are politically literate, much less hold politically coherent ideas, after we have gutted public education, turned schools into learning prisons and told young people over and over again they are consumers and not citizens. Political literacy, we learn, is no longer even a requirement for seeking political office, but is in fact seen as a drawback. And an important source of such political guidance, the left, has all but disappeared from mainstream life.
Within this context, it is amazing that any person in their twenties is able to develop anything resembling a coherent political framework for understanding the world, let alone acquire the tools to decipher between news and entertainment, to critically evaluate the fragments of information flying at them 24 hours a day from their TVs, computers and smart phones. Most do not have these tools by the time they arrive to college, and I long ago stopped expecting them to. But neither do I hold it against them, or dismiss their views simply because they are (from my perspective) muddled, incoherent and frequently go in completely opposite directions. I take them seriously both because it is my job as an educator and because I know a better future depends on equipping them with the ability to piece together a critical framework for understanding the world.
It is a bit ironic that at the same time as many commentators are urging us to listen more closely to our opponents' ideas and resist the urge to demonize them, that we are dismissing Loughner's political views without even so much as a real discussion. What he did is horrible, but the commentary has gone too quickly from "Loughner's actions were politically motivated" to "it had nothing to do with politics." We are now told that because his political views do not fall seamlessly into a neat box labeled "left" or "right" that they were irrelevant for understanding events in Arizona and, by connection, for understanding the current political situation in the United States. We should take Loughner's political views seriously. His mental state may have led him down a particularly destructive path, but his political confusion is by no means unique.
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He also read Ayn Rand -
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 10:38 — lauram (not verified)He also read Ayn Rand - which most postings seem to leave out. So, his reading list is pretty broad-based.
This is a very thoughtful,
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 10:38 — Anonymous (not verified)This is a very thoughtful, insightful and intelligent article. I know many people who pull political ideas from the Left and Right and come out with a schizoid analysis about what's wrong with America. Hardly anyone I know can recognize or distinguish between what hurts this country (more conservative politics as usual, delivered by anti-big government Republicans and Corporate Controlled Conservative Democrats) and what can help this nation (getting people elected like Ralph Nader and Bernie Sanders, who understand that government can and must be used to reign in greed, form social programs, tax the rich, protect the environment and create a 100% sustainable economy and energy system). Hardly anyone I know knows that FOX NEWS is a propaganda outlet for the Republican Party and a strong arm of Rupert Murdock to abduct and coerce governments around the world to adopt his globalized neoliberalism and ultimately make him king of the world.
Loughner has the excuse of
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 11:13 — Vic Anderson (not verified)Loughner has the excuse of schizophrenia; no such alibi can be afforded the BushCObamanible Intentional COGNITIVE DISSONANCE being foisted upon US.
Ayn Rand: last time I
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 11:45 — Anonymous (not verified)Ayn Rand: last time I checked, which was yesterday, her politics were very right-wing. just wanted to put that out there, as the Tea Party and Limbaugh tried to spin it that this kid was a left-wing lunatic pot smoker. Anyway, I also heard the rants on a radio show yesterday of Wilson, the guy who tried to shoot up liberals in the San Francisco area last summer. He admitted he got his reasons and rage from listening to Glenn Beck.
Yes, all the public hand
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 12:08 — Anonymous (not verified)Yes, all the public hand wringing over the terrible events in Tucson allow us to collectively ignore that the same thing happens in Iraq and Afghanistan EVERY DAY.
Loughner is probably being
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 12:25 — Anonymous (not verified)Loughner is probably being coached RIGHT NOW by Right Wing Republican attorneys to NOT SAY the names of Sarah Palin or Fox News or Beck or O'Reilly when the media finally gets to him and he'll have to explain for himself why he shot those people. He's probably going to be turned into another Manchurian Candidate. Even though he's already been exposed as a right wing Christian anti-abortion nutcase, not one investigator has been able to find out which sick Christian Church he attended in AZ. I also want to find out whether the Communist Manifesto was listed on FaceBook at the same time that Mein Kampf was, or if it was placed there later, closer to the shooting time. I could see the Right playing with his reading list to try to pin this on the Left prior to the shooting.
The only breadth anyone has
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 13:06 — Anonymous (not verified)The only breadth anyone has found in Loughner's reading list is The Communist Manifesto. Otherwise it's all right-wing.
That's one little book--not much more than a pamphlet--opposed to tome upon tome of fermented horseshit. In the case of Ayn Rand, the shit is piled very high and very deep, and it takes a certain amount of actual intellect (which Loughner does not possess) to deal with it.
Besides, the idea that Karl Marx and Adolf Hitler are the same is pushed both by the "false equivalence" liars of the mass media and by Glenn Beck, who has a kind of patent on calling leftists "hitlers."
This may be a common delusion of the unbelievebly shit-for-brains Average American, but there's a reason for that: it's in all the propaganda folks slurp up with their corn syrup.
The fact is that Jared Loughner couldn't have become what he is without the Koch Brothers and their subhuman kind. These people are the problem.
Let's not have any nonsense about being civil to these murderers. They have to be eliminated.
As someone else pointed out,
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 13:47 — Anonymous (not verified)As someone else pointed out, Ayn Rand is right-wing and full of crap (piles of it, to be sure).
The point is well taken, though, that kids aren't being taught how to think critically. Thus we get gullible adults who can't discriminate between good evidence and utter B.S. It's a tragedy borne of failed education policies (NCLB being the latest example) and the undue influence of Christian Supremacists.
Well, I do try to teach
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 14:20 — Anonymous (not verified)Well, I do try to teach critical thinking to my students. Of course it is always something for teachers to do: if you have a point of view, share it and tell your students it is your point of view, and grant that some sitting there in their desks might have another view.
I would have to say that the idea of teaching critical thinking is an easier task in a language arts class than in a history class. Students seem to respond to literature with factual information and thought-out ideas. In history, with so much of the curriculum fact-based, it's harder to get students to respond if they can't see relevance to what is happening today.
If any factually-based point of view is pushed, there are those out to de-bunk it. In studying the Great depression, for instance, students should learn that Glass-Steagall was a law that regulated banking and Wall Street in order to save them from themselves. On the other hand, now there's someone who gets on the TV occasionally to flog her so-called history of the Great Depression, with the disinformation that FDR's New Deal programs didn't work. Ask most in their 80's or 90's if it worked, and they will tell you it did! They were there, not like that 40 something woman who is probably funded by right-wing corporations to write a book intended to make social programs out to be bad for America.
When you take the American
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 14:28 — Frank (not verified)When you take the American mental health system (or lack thereof; second to all in the developed world) and link it up with the Second Amendment, what do people expect? Shock is appropriate; surprise isn't. Tucson is the cost of doing business.
Thank you! As a former
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 14:58 — anonymous (not verified)Thank you! As a former anthro/soc. instructor I am astonished at the number of young people I meet today who hold world views much like Jared Loughner. My 25 yr. old son told me many of his contemporaries believe Hitler was a liberal! Well, I guess there was that problematic word 'Socialist' in their party name, but, liberal?!
Conspiracy theories, tortured science facts, total lack of understanding of how even local politics function, cynicism, nihilism, frustration, distraction, substance abuse, and guns are a part of their universe.
When people started calling Loughner mentally ill I was not surprised. However, his worldview and how he reacts to it is just reflective of the larger culture. Evidence-based reality is spurned for interpreting your own reality. Ignore medical science and load up on unproven, self-researched alternative cures. " It must be true I read it on the internet!" Ignore scientific evidence when discussing climate change, new energy systems, land use regulations, you name it the voters out there do not want facts. They want what makes them feel comfortable. Tell them what they want to hear and they'll listen. Sarah Palin, many religious leaders on the right, and most politicians have figured this out.
Jared Loughner is us. He's just a 22 yr. old version. He's angry and frustrated at how complicated life has become. The rules are always in motion and it's hard to figure out which one to grab on to.
You are absolutely correct about public education. I was forced into home schooling. I am not opposed to home schooling, but, I can tell you that those parents who home school for non-religious, apolitical reasons are very few and far between. This is a thorny issue, but, the prevalence of parents who home school because they have disconnected from evidence-based reality learning should be a source of concern. The irony is that these folks hold a point of view that their doctrinal source is fact based on faith. It is unswerving. Yet, they can make up their own reality concerning every other facet of life. It's nothing short of comic book 'schizo' in an increasingly complex and dangerous world. Try teaching the chapter on evolution in Palin's neighborhood community college for amusement! It's guaranteed heartburn.
This is a very fair
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 15:12 — Anonymous (not verified)This is a very fair assessment of the multiple and contradictory 'sources' so many young people face today. After all, the majority of American pupils today believe the Nazis were our allies in World War II, and the Russians our enemies. I know A students in high school who vociferously deny that the USA dropped the atomic bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
If Jared Loughner is mentally ill, he reflects a very troubled sense of itself in the whole USA
For further insight into
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 15:18 — Anonymous (not verified)For further insight into college kid who grew up with weird political views, watch "Casino Jack and the United States of Money" an historical view of Jack Abramnoff - who just so happens to exemplify the new Republican world view.
It has led me to see the neo Republican as a person who doesn't have friends, like the Mafia you are either Family or enemy. I believe the popular phrase is "you're either with us or you're against us"
Unfortunately, while I think
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 15:34 — mr3 (not verified)Unfortunately, while I think this piece was a great insight into things, I think things are actually a little more dire than this. Many people observe the political spectrum as spanning "The Left" to "The Right" and draw what may seem like disparate conclusions about that spectrum...until as an observer you step outside that one-dimensional view and acknowledge ideas tangential to both directions. The way those of us treat those bodies of thought outside the 'number line' from left to right when our beliefs are firmly contained within it is telling. Most dismiss these ideas as anything from insane to cold-hearted to uneducated, or at least insignificant. Our society is so focused on left and right that we've given political power only to those two mindsets while vigorously dismissing the rest as threats to power much less threats to a widening of vision. We see the impact in obvious ways even, like when independents run for office--they have little recourse but to feel overwhelmingly outnumbered, even in a political climate as turned upside-down as ours is now. Even moderates along the center part of the line--and even those closer to a side that make decisions counter to that side--are viewed to an extent as traitors to one side or the other.
From an education perspective, you'd think education would at least have something to say here if not see itself as responsible for serving one of its core social functions--helping society learn about history in an unbiased way, and more importantly help us build mental tools to support independent thought. But it seems we've not only neglected to support education and to the extent of preventing it from being able to do this, we've more importantly allowed education to be influenced by 'social inertia' as much as any other social construct we've built. For example, some things are curiously left out of education.
Education may arguably be less equipped to address this situation than a more direct social shift in attitude would anyway though. Media however (arguably) does have the ability to affect this kind of shift. Its ability to bring high volumes of information within convenient proximity to us is one way. And not just information--thought, and the entirety of recorded thought without weight assigned to any in particular. We're in an information age, after all. But instead of use it for this potential, we seem to be content just letting it be a mirror of our current bi-polar mentality. There is little if any effort spent by media on viewing political thought and related social/historical attitudes as more than two opposite ends of a number line.
You would think this kind of mirroring would make our current social state apparent. Watching what we chose to do socially in response to last Saturday though told a much different story. There are problems we face now that alternate ideas have a lot to say about in terms of solutions. Social majority does not currently seem to be interested in this, however. It seems to be fully engaged in a power struggle on all levels between Left and Right.
what's this? another path
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 15:35 — Anonymous (not verified)what's this? another path ??
and why take this one now , they all seem so misleading, I mean, each and every every other time I thought I chose the true one.
-Mr. A. Par Tisan
“You can always count on Americans to do the right thing - after they've tried everything else.”
-Sir Winston Churchill
A genuinely profound
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 15:47 — Loren Bliss (not verified)A genuinely profound analysis, lacking only in its failure to identify the primary stolen link: the historical truth of class-struggle that -- had it not been methodically suppressed by Ruling Class schools and media -- would make sense of all that is being done to us, including our subjugation to inescapable powerlessness.
I am a Canadian and I find
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 16:21 — Anonymous (not verified)I am a Canadian and I find this kind of political confusion about right and left etc. is rampant with many people--including a former friend who used to boast about how she was superbly educated due to a scholarship to a British public ("private", in North American terminology) school. It's everywhere.
Meanwhile, our government
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 16:25 — mike rieman (not verified)Meanwhile, our government continues its murder spree abroad, payed for by you and me. Obama lectured us on civility at ground zero in Arizona, after ramping up drone attacks on wedding parties in Afghanistan and Pakistan, then signing the biggest defense bill in history. Talk about about schizophrenic!
Caution: Just because
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 16:35 — Voltairetoday (not verified)Caution: Just because Loughner listed on his Facebook page both Marx's Communist Manifesto and Hilter's Mein Kampf does NOT mean he read either, or that he subscribed to both leftist and rightist political philosophies. To think otherwise is a great leap.
Frankly, I can see nothing in his writings, videos or internet postings that is remotely left wing. To the contrary, I'd say he's clearly in the radical right wing camp.
"When asked, most students -
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 16:46 — New England professor (not verified)"When asked, most students - most Americans - "know" that Hitler and Marx are "bad," but very few can articulate what they stood for politically and many often assume that Nazi and Communist are synonymous."
Those who read this sentence as a statement of the author's own views--that Hitler and Marx are equally bad--need to reread this excellent piece more carefully. It should be obvious from the syntax and quotation marks that this are the putative views of most students, not the author. I had expected better of Truthout readers.
I agree with the previous
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 17:03 — Carl Darby (not verified)I agree with the previous poster "I can see nothing in his writings" -- absolutely nothing. Nothing but the incoherent rantings of a profoundly deranged individual. If anything he is in the radically insane camp.
The real elephant in the room are the anti-depressant meds he was on that can lead to suicidal/homicidal ideation as a potential side effect. This, not political ideology, not gun ownership, not age, not ethnicity, is a far more predictable indicator of someone "going postal".
Loughner's crimes appear to
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 17:11 — MeasureTwice (not verified)Loughner's crimes appear to be more paranoid that political, but within the angry politics of the day he seemed to find some resonance. I don't doubt if Marx had been the only thing on his bookshelf, the murders would be accepted as deeply political. As Sahar Aziz suggested elsewhere on Truthout, had Loughner had any brush with Islam, there is little doubt he would be seen as a true political terrorist.
This is the best assesment
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 17:46 — billy bob (not verified)This is the best assesment of what's going on I've read.
Since when does being a psychopath set him apart from the tea-party view of being "center right"?
Could we please stop the
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 18:46 — nazani14 (not verified)Could we please stop the book-bashing? The author complains that students don't know anything, yet points a finger at Loughner for reading political books that everyone should have at least familiarity with. He also read Siddhartha, Plato's Republic, and Animal Farm. So what? All his reading list proves is that an intelligent mind has gone to waste.
I read Arthur Conan Doyle, but I don't believe there are fairies at the bottom of my garden.
"The point is well taken,
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 19:31 — Anonymous (not verified)"The point is well taken, though, that kids aren't being taught how to think critically. "
This same educational philosophy has been in place at least 30+ years. that's a couple generations not just one.
kids are also scapegoated by every single generation.
this is a discriminatory practice i'd like to see put to an end.
I agree totally. The
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 20:04 — Jim del Norte (not verified)I agree totally. The insanity it is there, but it is very much conditioned by a collectively insane political culture in which people easily become mixed up and prone to all sorts of demagogies and conspiracy theories and impossible mélanges because of the general context of political and historical illiteracy.
I'm a little tired of this
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 20:25 — Unverified Poster (not verified)I'm a little tired of this allegedly "neutral" perspective that "fascism" and "communism" are these opposite and equal evils on a linear plane. With the speaker, in a debate between left and right, generally undermining the left with their position, and supporting and empowering the right. continued ..
continued .. Indeed, I think
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 20:26 — Unverified Poster (not verified)continued .. Indeed, I think that's one reason rhetoric from irresponsible Fox newscasters and the likes of Sarah Palin has gained such an upper hand, with consequence in Arizona ranging from incredibly loose gun control, horrific treatment of immigrants, and ignorant hysteria about this health care reform bill being "communist" or "socialist" when it is nothing of the sort -- indeed, we would be much better off with a socialist system as in the U.K., if you want to get real with this subject. continued ..
continued ..The politically
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 20:28 — Unverified Poster (not verified)continued ..The politically problematic climate in this country at present is coming from the right, not the left. The right is publicly advocating violence, not the left. This fellow, mentally disturbed or not, walked into a peaceful political public meeting, assassinated an elected official, a federal judge, 3 senior citizens, a child interested in politics and on a school assignment for her student government, and a young aide about to be married and in for a promising career himself in politics. Not political? *Just* mentally disturbed? Again, get real. continued ..
continued .. The fact that
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 20:31 — Unverified Poster (not verified)continued .. The fact that he was reading Hitler AND Karl Marx doesn't mean he was a leftist at all. Nor does it imply, as the writer does indeed do, that Hiler and Karl Marx are anything alike? How informed is the writer on these two books? Does he happen to know that we wouldn't have a study of sociology in the United States if it weren't for Karl Marx? No social security, no medicaid or medicare. Karl Marx the same as Hitler? Give me a break! This reader really reads!
Loughner was influenced by RIGHT-wing views on health care, on immigration, on gun rights, and prevalent right wing talk on how they were going to blow them liberal commies away, all as targeted by Sarah Palin's gun viewing maps, as expressed in their venomous expressions of hatred in Tea Party demonstrations, disrupting Town Hall meetings, klan-like activities around immigration, you name it. Please, writer, tell me where the left comes into this young man's mind. Give your "neutralism" a break, and try some intellectual honesty for a change -- meaning that you can indeed take sides. Oh - and while we're at it -- do you any of you older adults, including the writer, know that Pete Seeger considers him a communist?
Amen. Can we have a little
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 20:51 — Anonymous (not verified)Amen. Can we have a little more Glasnost please? Can the writer stop shuddering in the shadow of McCarthy?
How much more does the real left have to pay for this fake neutralism and apologetic appeasement talk from people who want to appear "moderate"?
If more people were less concerned with being "politically correct" and just unapologetically told more of these righties to sit down and shut up (since that really is ALL they understand), we probably wouldn't be looking at all these dead people in Arizona right now.
Now that's realism.
If the shooter had a copy of
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 22:04 — whaler (not verified)If the shooter had a copy of Hitler's M.K. and a copy of The Holy Bible, would that mean they are twin evils on opposite ends of a straight line?
Is it possible, just
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 22:21 — Anonymous (not verified)Is it possible, just possible, that the people who bombed the World Trade Center were crazy lunatics as well?
If so, does that mean that no one is responsible and that it was just one of those things?
Maybe we shouldn't hold bin laden responsible. Afterall, it isn't as if HE piloted the plane.
Maybe the rules change depending on who the terrorists involved are.
Just a thought.
This is a crucial
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 22:26 — Anonymous (not verified)This is a crucial point---and I say this speaking as someone committedly left-of-center who has felt the pull of whirlpools like 9/11 Trutherism (hey, if GWB would start a war in Iraq for no discernible reason, what wouldn't he do??) and recently had a fellow Unitarian try to sell me on the Bilderberger conspiracy. The noted failure in education is a huge factor---I also got to college not knowing what "right" or "left" meant. We're also in an environment where disaffection and distrust toward the political establishment is intense and indeed very rational for a lot of people; bait left out for the politically marginalized will get bites without regard to what margin a person is on.
I have been disturbed to hear commentators write Loughner off as "apolitical." He clearly was intensely political. The word they want is "non-partisan"---as in not conforming to the ideas of a recognized party, no fault per se but taking a horrible form in this instance. Except that the commentators don't want to use that word because they fetishize it and don't want any stains on it.
anonymous 01:51 - Thank you
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 22:28 — Anonymous (not verified)anonymous 01:51 -
Thank you for restoring my faith that I'm not the only one who isn't forgetting what got us here in the first place. This is what happens when the left "draws a line in the sand". The right crosses it and the left apologizes.
At least the right actually believes their psycho-talk. The left doesn't seem to stand for anything anymore.
I am shocked to see one
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 23:09 — Anonymous (not verified)I am shocked to see one person, at least, on this forum claiming these murders were NOT political. Why can't you see that these murders were ONLY political. Forget the insanity defense. Any gun wielding murder is insane. But this guy is a right wing anti-abortion nutcase.
Insanity, while accurate, is
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 23:09 — Anonymous (not verified)Insanity, while accurate, is far from sufficient to explain what happened in Arizona. The shooter is a violent person, and he lived in within the toxic environment that we call suburban America.
Not everybody has the advantage of being surrounded by intelligent, educated, reasonable, and highly successful people; advantages that his direct counterpoint, his 9 y/o victim, could claim. The majority of us live in a world where what passes for intellectual discussion comes from cable television, or the things we find and interpret on our own.
The shooter in Arizona is a violent person, and he will pay for his crimes. But we as a nation create the environment from which this sort of person will on occasion emerge.
We're further down the road
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 23:53 — mcthorogood (not verified)We're further down the road towards Fascism than most Americans would care to admit. Big business allegedly attempted a fascist coup in the U.S. in 1933, known as the Business Plot. Today we are willing participants as the U.S. government and corporations rape third world populations, and destroy the planet in the process.
Is there any reason to be upset? You betcha! There are only the super-rich that have pull, and the rest of us peons -- whether conservative, liberal, black or white.
A good start would be to require students to read Howard Zinn's book, A People's History of the United States.
I so agree with this
Sat, 01/15/2011 - 23:57 — leah stark (not verified)I so agree with this article.Because when I listen to all the info that's out there.I get confused and sometimes I think there isn't anything I can do about it.It's really frustrating.I listen to one talking head on MSNBC and then another on Fox and I think WOW they are completely opposite.Two different views and how they spin it.When it's all said and done it comes down to what a voter thinks .Do they think conservative,Who only think about their own rights.liberal who care about everyone's rights or Independent that care about everyone's rights as long as it doesn't infringe on their personal interest.When it dose ,their against it.Hypocrisy is what drives me insane.And in no way am I condoning what Loughner did.I'm just saying That if your mentally unstable.Stuff like this could be so confusing that it could make you paranoid enough to do something we as a society would think is insane.WORDS MATTER!!!!!!!!
Loughner certainly appears
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 00:32 — Urgelt (not verified)Loughner certainly appears to be a paranoid schizophrenic. I guess we'll learn more about that from his trial.
Assuming that he is one, I think those of us who seek answers in his political views will be disappointed. His actions did not arise out of reason. His is a profoundly broken mind.
The larger question to answer is whether a paranoid schizophrenic can be influenced and urged to violence by a toxic political environment. My opinion is a cautious "yes." Schizophrenics do not live in insulating bubbles. They can learn, they can react to stimuli, they can understand and echo hatred and bigotry and violent rhetoric.
Toxic rhetoric *can* be expected to incite disturbed people to violence.
As for student confusion over the old left-right political continuum: that paradigm holds little explanatory power for America in the year 2011. It's no wonder they pay little attention to it. Progressives have been nearly locked out of mainstream media and the political dialogue; their views exist mainly at fringe sites on the web. Nearly all of the voices we hear now - even the so-called "centrists" - support the use of governmental power to advantage oligopolistic corporations over the interests of everyone else. We have a full-blown kleptocracy, and it is not going to end well.
But Loughner is not responding rationally to a genuine existential threat to our nation's welfare. His ideas and actions do not illuminate our political landscape.
He . . .also . . . thought
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 02:01 — rock (not verified)He . . .also . . . thought we should be on a gold standard. Um, I believe that was the "Acapulco Gold" standard he was referring [ha!ha!] to.
Also, did or did he not post a rant opposing the war in Afghanistan? Sounds like a true right-winger allright.
"Give me control of a
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 02:22 — Bill O'Rights (not verified)"Give me control of a nations money supply, and I care not who makes it’s laws." Mater Amschel Rothschild, founder of the Rothschild banking dynasty. - That the writer above dismisses Loughner's idea that we are being controlled by our money system is just plain stupid. "Attracted to conspiracy theories" - so what? There have been conspiracies throughout human history - why would it be any different now? - because we have computers and drive fancy cars? What a nit-wit Striffler is. The shooter is a drug addict psychopath - that is a separate issue than whether there was merit to some of his ideas. What an incredible bore this "Left vs Right" paradigm has become.
DUH!! Toxic rhetoric--what
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 02:46 — janbelle (not verified)DUH!! Toxic rhetoric--what next. Again, more hot "air" from both sides. When are the "right" and "left" going to awaken to the fact that they are both controlled by the same groups under different names,foundations,etc. Our country's constitution was formulated by the the "rich and famous" landowners,bankers,business people of the day. Keeping the wealth in the few hands of the "chosen" has always been the name of the name of the game and continues to this day. All these "public shock" events are distractions. They are meant to get folks caught up in meaningless rhetoric supposedly about the causing, again, more dissension. This kid shooter was a set up mind controlled tool--yeah--look up govt mind control experiments,hearings,military,etc. It's all out there and makes way more sense than the BS put out there by the both the right and left. Hiding in this kid's family background is for certain to be some kind of govt., military,defense and/or Fundy church connection
Janbelle - before knocking
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 03:18 — Bill O'Rights (not verified)Janbelle - before knocking the Constitution and our Republic, you should travel a little and see how the rest of the world lives - note that it was our system that produced the longest running prosperity in modern history, while the central control freaks on both the left and the right have run up the tab and will take us down just like the same forces have bankrupted all those European nations. No system is perfect - care to name one anywhere in the world that is better than ours has been over the last two hundred years? This has been the place that even the poor could realize their dreams - at least until the Federal Government started spending like a drunken sailor following Nixon taking us off the gold standard.
George Orwell - - In a time
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 05:16 — Anonymous (not verified)George Orwell -
- In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
Of course there are a lot of
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 06:32 — PJ Cats (not verified)Of course there are a lot of folks like Loughner around, and there'll only be more. I read the article in the New York Times on him this morning and he comes across as a person who asks all the right questions, but unfortunately comes up with all the wrong answers. And then acts accordingly. Maybe it just goes to show how fast a (about average) person can go from sane to insane in the modern age.
You really need some gun laws out there, or there'll be more killings. I'm sure we would have had more of them overhere in Europe (we had two here in Holland, actually, in 2002 and 2005), if it wasn't for our strict laws. It is, I'm afraid, that simple.
Prof. Stiffler's comments
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 09:23 — jim conners (not verified)Prof. Stiffler's comments are an accurate account of the way things are in this country. Many of the responses to it only prove him right as most of them show the writers are as confused as his students.
We are a nation of idiots who have been taught that their opinions are as valid as the next person despite evidence to the contrary. We have indeed been gamed by those with the money.
Sadly the only solution is a total failure like happened in 1929 AND a leader like FDR with the brains and principles to fix the mess.
.
Loughner could be sane. We
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 09:40 — Anonymous (not verified)Loughner could be sane. We don't know. We won't even call him a terrorist. He calls himself a terrorist. We'll call Mohamed Osman Mohamud a terrorist, but not Loughner. So how can all of these judgments be considered reliable?
Maybe we are the insane. Our collective heads shoved so far up our collective ass we can't imagine anything in existence that doesn't stink of our own shit.
Maybe we are the insane.
As For Gun-Banning Being the
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 11:17 — Bill O'Rights (not verified)As For Gun-Banning Being the 'solution' - firstly, take note of the rates of gun violence in places where they are banned - Chicago's gun crimes are off the charts. Note that D.C.'s gun violence has dropped since guns were allowed there, the same is true in state after state that has passed concealed carry permits - the statistics are unambiguous - more guns, less violence. Look at Switzerland - every adult male in the country is required to keep a gun and be trained in it's use - they have exceptionally low crime. The correlation is way to big to blame it on cultural or economic factors.
@16:17 Now go study
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 12:33 — Anonymous (not verified)@16:17 Now go study Cananda's shooting fatality statistics and compare them to the US's. Canada does not legalize the use of killing weaponry, such as hand guns. You will see how low Canada's rates are because gun's are mostly prohibited.
Wow! Who wudda thunk...from
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 12:46 — sharon (not verified)Wow!
Who wudda thunk...from the vitriol on this blog, we are a fractured society.
[An aside: the spelling and grammatical errors abound.]
Is the communist manifesto
Sun, 01/16/2011 - 15:49 — TessyRen (not verified)Is the communist manifesto really 'far left'? It didn't say people should be recycled if they couldn't produce or anything, geez. People who gathered with that document in hand gave us 'far left' reforms like an eight hour workday.
I find it frustrating that
Mon, 01/17/2011 - 08:45 — Anonymous Mama (not verified)I find it frustrating that some 19 year olds attending community college in a small community "hate liberals", yet, as discussed above, rarely actually know what that means and unfortunately, neither do their minimally educated parents. If and when individuals hold themselves accountable for trying to learn what these terms really mean and how they apply to their own lives, we might have some real voters. Until then, it's who is loudest...
Democracy by GroupThink doesn't give me a lot of faith in our process or our system and parents who insist their kids just mirror them don't either. I don't have a remedy, but I feel it is very dangerous. Our Constitution was written primarily by intellectual free thinkers, and statistically, that's not the majority of Americans, but, it could be. It's a matter of personal accountability and ownership of individual potential to think and discriminate, in a healthy way...
The kid is sick period, but
Mon, 01/17/2011 - 12:32 — d moran (not verified)The kid is sick period, but not because he's confused politically. Hell, I'm an elderly Ph.D. who has been a political junkie for years. Long term Dem now totally disillusioned by what I see as their capitulation to fascist powers of MIC, bankers, corporate masters. Repubs are beyond the pale. Only thing is they're open about it.
Conspiracy theorist? Yes, a government conspiracy to hide motives from an electorate too ignorant to figure out that both reigning parties care only about their own re-elections.
So, the 2012 election will proceed as in the recent past, and we'll think we're making a choice. Too brainwashed to realize that we need at least one third party that will represent the interests of ordinary citizens who are being screwed across the board.
Am I crazy?
This is a guy whose main
Tue, 01/18/2011 - 10:03 — Peter Kauffner (not verified)This is a guy whose main "political" idea is that the government is using the rules of grammar to control us. It's highly unlikely that he has read either the "Communist Manifesto" or "Mein Kampf". To put them both on his list of "favorite read" is a way of putting himself above the left vs. right politics.
Loughner hated GW Bush.
Tue, 01/18/2011 - 21:33 — Anonymous (not verified)Loughner hated GW Bush.
So these young people not
Wed, 01/19/2011 - 15:05 — Tim (not verified)So these young people not having enough education about politics, and political history is... what? Problematic? Part of THE problem? Was it part of the cause of this incident? What is the actual point of this article besides saying that young people don't know jack about the world, which is needless to say? If it is suggested to be a problem, then wouldn't the blame fall on the teachers for not teaching this stuff? At the very least a basic understand of the different beliefs held be Left and Right political movements and their histories should be taught, and could be without bias. So are you admitting that teachers, the vast overwhelming majority of which in this country are LIBERALS, failed our kids, and THIS kid?
Which is worst, liberal teachers NOT teaching our kids the difference between liberal and conservative, or the history of all of the varied political movements in recent/relevant history, or the fact that when they DO teach about those things, they do it WITH bias? My sister recently informed me that her professor was railing about Sarah Palin's responsibility for the incident. So which would I prefer? For you liberal teachers to not teach this stuff and keep producing ignorant yet loudmouthed kids, or for you to try to feed them their beliefs? Seems either way the country is screwed.
Piastra Ghd
Mon, 01/21/2013 - 12:18 — Piastra Ghd (not verified)http://www.energia-brasil.com/index.php/les-cours/danse-bresilienne/item/100-professeur-de-danse/100-professeur-de-danse?start=1190
Calzado Mbt
Mon, 01/21/2013 - 12:29 — Calzado Mbt (not verified)http://www.excellentstorestt.com/index.php/promotions/item/3-kowal-team-new-website/3-kowal-team-new-website?start=166970
Timberland
Mon, 02/04/2013 - 10:50 — Timberland (not verified)But we don't know each otherit wouldn't be right, would it?" she stated, doubtfully.